Power restriction in first 3 gears now lifted

[SisuTen]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

Actually I would like to Bitch about both modes! IMO I don't want either! Just give me what it's got! Let me be the judge! As far as the Traction control, on or off would be good I don't need 1 & 2. And as long as I'm venting make the ABS on and off also. I raced my friend in the S mode, we are even as far as skill level goes, we've been riding together since 1966, we've both had some fairly high level accomplishments. I would enjoy the S/10 a lot more with someone not trying to second guess me! Maybe I should have looked a little closer at some of the other bikes. BMW, KTM, Triumph! I have been pro Yamaha for some time worked and grew up in a Yamaha, Triumph, BSA shop. Better Luck next time! There is always going to be a better mouse trap! I was hoping this was it!

I detect a basic misunderstanding of what the bike actually was intended to do prior to your purchase. You chose poorly.

I believe you should sell your bike, get something different that suits your expectations and relieve your stress.

 

[JHKolb]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

Actually I would like to Bitch about both modes! IMO I don't want either! Just give me what it's got! Let me be the judge! As far as the Traction control, on or off would be good I don't need 1 & 2. And as long as I'm venting make the ABS on and off also. I raced my friend in the S mode, we are even as far as skill level goes, we've been riding together since 1966, we've both had some fairly high level accomplishments. I would enjoy the S/10 a lot more with someone not trying to second guess me! Maybe I should have looked a little closer at some of the other bikes. BMW, KTM, Triumph! I have been pro Yamaha for some time worked and grew up in a Yamaha, Triumph, BSA shop. Better Luck next time! There is always going to be a better mouse trap! I was hoping this was it!

As much as I can agree I don't want some pocket protector type dictating my riding style by overly controlling how I use the equipment, I think of all the ADV bikes the Yamaha is probably one of the least overburdened with electronics. Have you ever looked at the gear on the Duc MS1200? Insane amount of setting and controls to deal with, and the BMW with TC/ABS/Elec Suspension controls. Just want to ride not be stuck in the driveway fussing with 100 different electronic settings for my days ride. With the Yamaha I pretty much leave it in TC1 all the time, and for commuting/lazy riding stick to T mode, only really use S mode for more aggressive road work.

 

[WRW9751]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

Please to all, don't misunderstand me I think the bike has some monumental break throughs! I think traction control is wonderful and here to stay. ABS is and will be lifesaving feature! I wouldn't have even given The S/10 a second glance without them. What mostly disappoints me, is the lack of information that Yamaha put out prior to it's release. They had ampule time to say we are limiting your horsepower 30% in the first three gears! They also could have given us the simple option to shut off any and all their (pocket protectors) with little or no expense to them! Not to shift all the lack of information to them, I should have more creative in finding this stuff out! Shame on me! One thing is for sure, I will never not ask these questions from now on!

 

[spasm]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

overall theres nothing wrong with the xt1200z its an absolute beast thats been tamed by....... emssion restrictions, all u guys need to do is as i said before ......... unleash the power.
its a simple process. new exhaust... k&n filter.... power commander with optimiser.... and a great bike tuner such as my guys.
so the result is..... from a tame modest 1200 to a .
FOOKIN 1200 SUPERMOTO ANIMAL THAT GROWLS OUT OF EVERY CORNER AND IS CONSTANTLY TRYING TO LIFT THE FRONT WHEEL
handling is amazing.... looks are amazing...
over n out

 

[k woo]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

As much as I can agree I don't want some pocket protector type dictating my riding style by overly controlling how I use the equipment, I think of all the ADV bikes the Yamaha is probably one of the least overburdened with electronics. Have you ever looked at the gear on the Duc MS1200? Insane amount of setting and controls to deal with, and the BMW with TC/ABS/Elec Suspension controls. Just want to ride not be stuck in the driveway fussing with 100 different electronic settings for my days ride. With the Yamaha I pretty much leave it in TC1 all the time, and for commuting/lazy riding stick to T mode, only really use S mode for more aggressive road work.

Agreed. I work on european equipment overburdened with electronics and needless complexity for a living. All that crap is fine until it tears up.

 

[~TABASCO~]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

overall theres nothing wrong with the xt1200z its an absolute beast thats been tamed by....... emssion restrictions, all u guys need to do is as i said before ......... unleash the power.
its a simple process. new exhaust... k&n filter.... power commander with optimiser.... and a great bike tuner such as my guys.
so the result is..... from a tame modest 1200 to a .
FOOKIN 1200 SUPERMOTO ANIMAL THAT GROWLS OUT OF EVERY CORNER AND IS CONSTANTLY TRYING TO LIFT THE FRONT WHEEL
handling is amazing.... looks are amazing...
over n out

X2 When are you going to send us your super map ? ::008::

 

[jajpko]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

This is just a thought, but do you suppose Yamaha limited the power in 1,2, and 3 to save the final drive from Hooligans? ::025::

 

[WRW9751]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

I've been thinking (again) I wonder how the Computer knows what gear it's in? Could the indicator be tricked into thinking it's in 4th always? Is it simply another type of neutral safety switch? This might be easier to do than you might think. I will investigate some and get back to you all.

 

[Blue_eyes]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

I've been thinking (again) I wonder how the Computer knows what gear it's in? Could the indicator be tricked into thinking it's in 4th always? Is it simply another type of neutral safety switch? This might be easier to do than you might think. I will investigate some and get back to you all.

Look 12 posts back... I think most of what you are looking for is already posted in this topic.

 

[GrahamD]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

Please to all, don't misunderstand me I think the bike has some monumental break throughs! I think traction control is wonderful and here to stay. ABS is and will be lifesaving feature! I wouldn't have even given The S/10 a second glance without them. What mostly disappoints me, is the lack of information that Yamaha put out prior to it's release. They had ampule time to say we are limiting your horsepower 30% in the first three gears! They also could have given us the simple option to shut off any and all their (pocket protectors) with little or no expense to them! Not to shift all the lack of information to them, I should have more creative in finding this stuff out! Shame on me! One thing is for sure, I will never not ask these questions from now on!

There seems to be a consensus among Japanese manufacturers that they will first and foremost try and keep the majority of customers happy over the long term.

That has been my experience. It worked very well for them over the years, if you remember that BMW, Triumph Ducati, HD almost died in the 80's because their bikes had a bit too much character for most people.

So, in the case of the S10, when it was being developed, the Eurozone was about to mandate that all bikes over 125cc were to have ABS and it was not to be defeat-able.

YAMAHA's response along with the German ABS supplier (Not Bosch) was to step up to the plate and do a better job on the ABS. The Euro Manufacturers responded by bitching and moaning and got the Government to change their mind. So it was pushed back to 2017 leaving YAMAHA with it's pants down.

I don't know where the first three gear thing comes from, but Suzuki do it, YAMAHA do it and the current crop of super bikes do it in a different way.
Even the old Carbureted SV650 I ran had it. (Which was bypassed). I have never noticed it that much on the bigger bikes 'cause I really don't find it that much of an issue, but the SV650 I did. It most probably came from the sports bike market where brainless met huge horsepower and someone sued.

We now have tip over sensors, side stand switches, power limiters in gears, ABS that will likely not be switchable in a few years, Cat converters and Huge things for mufflers courtesy of Government Regs and lawsuits. Now YAMAHA could just ignore as much as this as possible but is probably worried about class action law suits coming from somewhere because some bunch of idiots decide that they should have made sure that YAMAHA catered for there dumb ass brains not working correctly and decided to blame them for the mess they are in.

This is why I have all these wonderful things to look forward to when I jump in my car. Alarms go off when the door is open, alarms go off when I have the lights on, I can't drop it into gear without putting my foot on the brake, etc etc etc.

The other problem is reviewers add points for features. This bike is better because it has 26 different friggen suspensions maps, and modes and shit. You are honestly better off these days as a manufacturer to give someone 3 way adjustable average (ESA) than you are doing a basic suspension well.

SO, when purchasing a bike I am glad that in the background, there is always someone beavering away to get around all this stuff, if needed. I would like to be able to kill the rear ABS but the front can stay on. That would be good for me on occasion, Others choices may vary.

The bottom line might be this. In a court of law, the manufacturers can state that they took all reasonable steps to protect you from yourself and if you disabled the safety features then it's not their fault. If they don't install them then it may mean a big payout, which will mean everyone will pay a bit more on the next purchase.

YAMAHA seem to have managed to limit the techno gadgetry this time around to those things that could be considered safety features. The apparently were in talks with Ohlins about remote adjustable suspension but decided to ditch that for now. What might be good is for YAMAHA to allow you to do a special order, after signing a legal disclaimer but I have a feeling that may be of no use either.

Cheers
Graham

 

[Combo]

I agree with you Graham all the way. As a matter of fact the lawsuit average price from the bean counters is built right into the price of our bikes and everthing we buy.

I know one thing, I could do without the sticker on my lawn mower that says do not place hand in here when running. ::010::
Dumb lawsuits have made everything go up in cost with stupid things installed as a result.

I would like to see the day again when the judges say get the heck out of here. If that doesn't happen then let's donate all our old 3 wheelers to all the stupid people. ::025::

 

[troll]

You are on the money Graham ::024:: Many purchasers today do not have the reflexes or skills to manually manage an unrestrained 1200cc motorsyckle and the deaths and lawsuit indicate the truth of this. The non-riding public also drives this issue because we scare them with our hooligan moves. The XT12 uncorked I am sure will come on like a monster ::26:: ???

 

[~TABASCO~]

You are on the money Graham ::024:: Many purchasers today do not have the reflexes or skills to manually manage an unrestrained 1200cc motorsyckle and the deaths and lawsuit indicate the truth of this. The non-riding public also drives this issue because we scare them with our hooligan moves. The XT12 uncorked I am sure will come on like a monster ::26:: ???

X2... I have and its a beast. Im just about at that stage Its only getting better with the maps and tuning. Even if there comes a cheep way to gain max HP in 1-2-3 I dont think im interested.
Not specifically directed to you Troll, I have uncorked the bike and its totally different than stock.. Im beginning to think and about to say that its totally different that the CO / AS Adj. A few bolt on mods to let this bike breath will unleash the beast ! I agree with Graham and COMBO aswell... When they develop these bikes they have to make it the best they can for XXX amount of money and to appease the most about of people. Keep in mind that probably less than 10% of the new Super Tenere owners read forums. Less than 10% even know anything about what we are talking about. That leaves about 90% that are riding a stock bike and think its awesome, great and best !! Over all I still give Yamaha an A+ for develping this bike they way they have. (understanding all the areas around the world there hands are tied). The bike is bad ass, and for people that want more, buy a few bolt on parts and HOLD ON !

 

[Tremor38]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

I've been thinking (again) I wonder how the Computer knows what gear it's in? Could the indicator be tricked into thinking it's in 4th always? Is it simply another type of neutral safety switch? This might be easier to do than you might think. I will investigate some and get back to you all.

Yeah, Blue Eyes said it's an RPM vs speed calculation in the ECU. That's probably why it's difficult to defeat. I think the most direct way is the chip tuning method that the Germans came-up with. Hopefully that will become more wide-spread, so the price will come down a bit.

 

[Bundu]

Does anybody know if the 1200GS is limited in the lower gears? If not, why should the Yamaha be?

If I pay for 81kW, I want 81kW... From what I've read, the S10 never achieves 81kW, so why advertise it as such?

What is the total cost of all these extras one has to add to 'unleash' the S10?

 

[colorider]

Graham, well said!!!
::026::

Rod

 

[Blue_eyes]

Re: Power limitation in first 3 gears now lifted

Actually I would like to Bitch about both modes! IMO I don't want either! Just give me what it's got! Let me be the judge! As far as the Traction control, on or off would be good I don't need 1 & 2. And as long as I'm venting make the ABS on and off also. I raced my friend in the S mode, we are even as far as skill level goes, we've been riding together since 1966, we've both had some fairly high level accomplishments. I would enjoy the S/10 a lot more with someone not trying to second guess me! Maybe I should have looked a little closer at some of the other bikes. BMW, KTM, Triumph! I have been pro Yamaha for some time worked and grew up in a Yamaha, Triumph, BSA shop. Better Luck next time! There is always going to be a better mouse trap! I was hoping this was it!

Acording to this "big ADV shootout" the XT1200Z beats the BMW R1200GS in a 0-60 sprint.... The XT1200Z is the fastest 0-60 mph bike in that test.... Even way faster than the Ducati 150 HP powerhouse!

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/272/11082/Motorcycle-Article/2012-Yamaha-Super-Tenere-Comparison.aspx

See the right hand column!

Imagine what that beast does when you bolt on a full non cat header, Akra slip-on, PC-V and Autotune like Jaxon, SpeedStar ands Spasm did and I have done (AT to be fitted when I return from vacation)!

The only wish I still have is to have the restriction in gears 1-3 lifted, but that is just a matter of time. My girlfriend asked me the last time she sat on the back if I still thought the XT1200Z was less powerful than my XJR1300 (which had 100 RW HP and 110 RW Nm on the dyno).... Hell no, I said, now (with the above items installed) it feels just as powerfull!!! Even she could feel the hughe difference these mods made.

As said by others before, restricting the lower gears is common practice nowadays, most will never even notice, only some will. That is where aftermarket vendors like healtech play their role.



Get the mods done, and you will not be dissapointed!

 

[Bundu]

Maybe you're looking at power at the rear wheel, IE dyno runs? Yamaha publishes the reading at the ouput shaft.

Nope, below are German tests at shaft and at wheel

 

[Blue_eyes]

Maybe you're looking at power at the rear wheel, IE dyno runs? Yamaha publishes the reading at the ouput shaft.

Nope, Yamaha reports crank HP's, just like all others. But, Yamaha is always very "optimistic" in it's power spec's. I've never come across any report that did not show that Yamaha had less power than specified, it mosty has the biggest deficit in measured power versus specified power of any of the bikes in the tests. Yamaha is always overly optimistic when it comes to power spec's of it's bikes.

But they make very reliable bikes for that matter, that's worth a whole lot too, especially when riding in the outback.

 

[Tremor38]

Nope, Yamaha reports crank HP's, just like all others. But, Yamaha is always very "optimistic" in it's power spec's. I've never come across any report that did not show that Yamaha had less power than specified, it mosty has the biggest deficit in measured power versus specified power of any of the bikes in the tests. Yamaha is always overly optimistic when it comes to power spec's of it's bikes.

But they make very reliable bikes for that matter, that's worth a whole lot too, especially when riding in the outback.

I see.