Will you take the vaccine

[MattR]

The joke is people who have gone into hiding and then accuse those who don't cower in their homes of 'selfishness'..... Its to late for me to stay home, I've been coast to coast on the bike twice since the china flu became a thing. I'm not going to stop living because of the fear mongering.

Although you might stop living because of the Rona..


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[pooh and xtine]

I can’t understand how western society has fractured so people end up in polarised belief sets. You either believe that covid is the plague and we should do anything and everything at any cost or you believe that it’s all a great fuss about nothing. We can’t have a meaningful debate because any argument that challenges either belief is rejected out of hand by the other side. Even a suggestion that the middle ground could be a better way can’t even be considered by either side. It’s the same with left/right politics, Sunni/Shia, Brexit, BLM, law and order, immigration, international aid: there is no debate, just stating and restating your belief set. This is why western democracy will soon be dead (yo-yo ing from one party to another or atrophying in proportional representation) and the autocratic nations will prevail to lead the world.

 

[PhilPhilippines]

I can’t understand how western society has fractured so people end up in polarised belief sets. You either believe that covid is the plague and we should do anything and everything at any cost or you believe that it’s all a great fuss about nothing. We can’t have a meaningful debate because any argument that challenges either belief is rejected out of hand by the other side. Even a suggestion that the middle ground could be a better way can’t even be considered by either side. It’s the same with left/right politics, Sunni/Shia, Brexit, BLM, law and order, immigration, international aid: there is no debate, just stating and restating your belief set. This is why western democracy will soon be dead (yo-yo ing from one party to another or atrophying in proportional representation) and the autocratic nations will prevail to lead the world.

What makes you think you're the authoritaaaah on what is going on?

 

[tallpaul]

the autocratic nations will prevail to lead the world.

I believe a UK government minister said last week that the combined wealth of the world's autocratic nations will soon be greater than that of the democratic ones. It's a sobering thought, given that "the golden rule" usually wins in the end.

 

[Checkswrecks]

I can’t understand how western society has fractured so people end up in polarised belief sets. You either believe that covid is the plague and we should do anything and everything at any cost or you believe that it’s all a great fuss about nothing. We can’t have a meaningful debate because any argument that challenges either belief is rejected out of hand by the other side. Even a suggestion that the middle ground could be a better way can’t even be considered by either side. It’s the same with left/right politics, Sunni/Shia, Brexit, BLM, law and order, immigration, international aid: there is no debate, just stating and restating your belief set. This is why western democracy will soon be dead (yo-yo ing from one party to another or atrophying in proportional representation) and the autocratic nations will prevail to lead the world.

Unfortunately you're right according to a number of studies that have tracked this over time. There are now a number of these tracking projects that find a direct correlation of this to how people look at the response to COVID.

While I recognize you are in the UK, these US charts show the middle is getting pretty lonely. People seem to have forgotten the compromises that went into creating the various countrys' Constitutions and I think it's because the extremists at each end have learned to benefit by polarizing us against ourselves. The Western democratic model of Government was based in give & take, which takes understanding where the views of other individuals are based and that we are not going to always agree because we're different.
But that takes effort.

Understanding allows compromise while no compromise means no Constitutional form of Government.

The only answer has to be resisting the political and media siren calls of the extremists and really listen to individuals.

 

[Cycledude]

Don’t forget Many of the replies in thread are from folks just hoping to stir the pot.

 

[ballisticexchris]

Don’t forget Many of the replies in thread are from folks just hoping to stir the pot.

Boy ain't that the truth!! For me it's a serious topic as I have a family members that will have little chance for survival if they get COVID. So unfortunately there is no compromise in my life with the exception of lessening the risks as much as possible.

 

[PhilPhilippines]

Don’t forget Many of the replies in thread are from folks just hoping to stir the pot.

Opinions are strong of course, but I fully "get" where others are coming from. Politricians and the uber 1% cannot be trusted one iota. They do not give a flying f*ck for anyone but their own and, as such, should be watched VERY CAREFULLY!

That said, I believe that this is real and needs full compliance. I may be wrong (I often am) but from what I can extrapolate from the current data it is "a thing"...

 

[EricV]

Everything from candy bar advertising to politics has been pushing an "us and them" mentality for decades. It will be a hard road back to the middle ground and it likely won't happen until it gets so extreme that major backlash sets in universally from everyone getting tired of their fellow human beings trying so hard to self identify as "special" instead of just like everyone else on the planet.

Sadly, the historic event that unifies a nation is a common enemy.

Back on CV topic, the day after my second Pfizer shot and I have no muscle soreness or aches of any kind. I feel normal and fine. Well, as 'normal' as I ever get. No excessive fatigue, etc.

 

[RonH]

The more people that get the vaccine, the numbers of infected rise. Possibly the vaccine is increasing the spread of the crap. It don't matter, we are all pretty much done. Enjoy what you can for now and forget the days before this came, as those days are done.

 

[MattR]

Question . If you can’t trust politicians or experts, what’s the point of democracy? And if you can’t trust the police, what’s the point of law and order?

The fact is, you have to trust them.


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[pooh and xtine]

Everything from candy bar advertising to politics has been pushing an "us and them" mentality for decades. It will be a hard road back to the middle ground and it likely won't happen until it gets so extreme that major backlash sets in universally from everyone getting tired of their fellow human beings trying so hard to self identify as "special" instead of just like everyone else on the planet.

Sadly, the historic event that unifies a nation is a common enemy.

Back on CV topic, the day after my second Pfizer shot and I have no muscle soreness or aches of any kind. I feel normal and fine. Well, as 'normal' as I ever get. No excessive fatigue, etc.

I agree, we desperately seek identity and join tribes of like minded people to reaffirm how special and “right” we are. Social media has provided a platform for tribal echo chambers. In the past we had common enemies (the French, Spanish, Germans, Soviets) which provided unity and identity, but these have faded with globalisation, so we find it necessary to create other enemies such as Republicans, Tories, big business, the “Government”, diesel cars etc etc. Black people now find an immense sense of identity and common purpose in their revived hatred of white people and colonial history, women similarly in their hatred of men in terms of inequality and violence (even though reasonable steps have been taken to address the grievances of both minority tribes).

Democracy ends when tribes form their own political parties (the Scottish Nationalist Party here is a good example), so when we start to see the Muslim Party or the Womens Alliance Party, we’ll witness the beginning of the end and a fracturing of society. Political parties representing a specific section of society or tribe are incompatible with democracy, but few constitutions prevent their establishment (restricting parties to policies for the entire electorate). Then again, we’re already seeing the non-acceptance of election results on the basis of “what is the Government going to do for the 48% who lost; we’re a huge minority?”.

3 weeks since my AZ jab, no side effects apart from a sore arm for a couple of days. Got to wait until May for my second, then a booster in October along with flu, pneumonia... We’ll be like pin cushions!

 

[PhilPhilippines]

I agree, we desperately seek identity and join tribes of like minded people to reaffirm how special and “right” we are. Social media has provided a platform for tribal echo chambers. In the past we had common enemies (the French, Spanish, Germans, Soviets) which provided unity and identity, but these have faded with globalisation, so we find it necessary to create other enemies such as Republicans, Tories, big business, the “Government”, diesel cars etc etc. Black people now find an immense sense of identity and common purpose in their revived hatred of white people and colonial history, women similarly in their hatred of men in terms of inequality and violence (even though reasonable steps have been taken to address the grievances of both minority tribes).

Democracy ends when tribes form their own political parties (the Scottish Nationalist Party here is a good example), so when we start to see the Muslim Party or the Womens Alliance Party, we’ll witness the beginning of the end and a fracturing of society. Political parties representing a specific section of society or tribe are incompatible with democracy, but few constitutions prevent their establishment (restricting parties to policies for the entire electorate). Then again, we’re already seeing the non-acceptance of election results on the basis of “what is the Government going to do for the 48% who lost; we’re a huge minority?”.

3 weeks since my AZ jab, no side effects apart from a sore arm for a couple of days. Got to wait until May for my second, then a booster in October along with flu, pneumonia... We’ll be like pin cushions!

Oh dear...

 

[Checkswrecks]

The more people that get the vaccine, the numbers of infected rise. Possibly the vaccine is increasing the spread of the crap. It don't matter, we are all pretty much done. Enjoy what you can for now and forget the days before this came, as those days are done.

Huh ???
That's pretty opposite of what the facts say. Stores and events around here are starting to open up nicely as a result too.

 

[PhilPhilippines]

I agree, we desperately seek identity and join tribes of like minded people to reaffirm how special and “right” we are. Social media has provided a platform for tribal echo chambers. In the past we had common enemies (the French, Spanish, Germans, Soviets) which provided unity and identity, but these have faded with globalisation, so we find it necessary to create other enemies such as Republicans, Tories, big business, the “Government”, diesel cars etc etc. Black people now find an immense sense of identity and common purpose in their revived hatred of white people and colonial history, women similarly in their hatred of men in terms of inequality and violence (even though reasonable steps have been taken to address the grievances of both minority tribes).

Democracy ends when tribes form their own political parties (the Scottish Nationalist Party here is a good example), so when we start to see the Muslim Party or the Womens Alliance Party, we’ll witness the beginning of the end and a fracturing of society. Political parties representing a specific section of society or tribe are incompatible with democracy, but few constitutions prevent their establishment (restricting parties to policies for the entire electorate). Then again, we’re already seeing the non-acceptance of election results on the basis of “what is the Government going to do for the 48% who lost; we’re a huge minority?”.

3 weeks since my AZ jab, no side effects apart from a sore arm for a couple of days. Got to wait until May for my second, then a booster in October along with flu, pneumonia... We’ll be like pin cushions!

Nice double down.

Can you tell me the last time your life was impacted by your supposition?

Perhaps you can indicate how your skin colour held you back in school...

....I will wait (but my post will be deleted- even though I am answering a post - as usual)

 

[Checkswrecks]

Nice double down.

Can you tell me the last time your life was impacted by your supposition?

Perhaps you can indicate how your skin colour held you back in school...

....I will wait (but my post will be deleted- even though I am answering a post - as usual)

The rule is not to attack other members, nothing about asking questions. Not deleting at this point but suggesting pooh just lets it go.

 

[PhilPhilippines]

The rule is not to attack other members, nothing about asking questions. Not deleting at this point but suggesting pooh just lets it go.

Easy to do I guess. Post, sidestep...

In 1975 my ex, at the age of 11, was refused entry to every Catholic school in her area of Greater London because she was black. She missed a whole year as a result. The first time she mentioned it was ten years into our relationship and I had to press her for the details as it was something that she preferred to forget. How much it held her back we will never know.

A half Indian, half Irish friend of mine's father used to get beaten up on a regular basis at his job. His crime was either being Indian or having a white wife or both, not sure.

There are plenty more examples to the two above. I understand the protest and where it comes from. I am not an advocate of the violence and the politricks that jumps on, but the majority is peaceful protesting past and current problems, not riots.

I will respond to misinformation and stoking about BAME, etc, etc...... Why do it??

If you are tired of hearing about racism, imagine how tired some people are of experiencing it!

 

[MattR]

The rule is not to attack other members, nothing about asking questions. Not deleting at this point but suggesting pooh just lets it go.

Unless the questions are about guns..


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[Boris]

In 1975 my ex, at the age of 11, was refused entry to every Catholic school in her area of Greater London because she was black. She missed a whole year as a result. The first time she mentioned it was ten years into our relationship and I had to press her for the details as it was something that she preferred to forget. How much it held her back we will never know.

Did these schools actually state she was being refused entry because she was black?

 

[ballisticexchris]

The rule is not to attack other members, nothing about asking questions. Not deleting at this point but suggesting pooh just lets it go.

Unless the questions are about guns..

Isn't that what we are talking about?