Super Tenere vs Ducati Multistrada

JackN

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As a new S10 owner I thought you guys might like to hear my impressions of the bike compared to the bike I traded.
Three weeks ago I traded my 2010 Ducati Multistrada for my 2012 Super Tenere. The decision to make the change was not an easy one for me. Despite the issues I had with the Duc, every time I rode it, it put huge grin on my face. I was very reluctant to give up the Ducati despite it’s problems because riding it was so enjoyable. It was a hard bike to give up. The power of that motor is very addictive and the handling of that bike is fantastic. Unfortunately, the Multistrada also has several known problems. Many Multi owners are willing to put up with these issues, and for a while I was one of them, but a few weeks ago I had reached my limit. I began to feel the pros of Multistrada ownership were being outweighed by the cons. Although they are entirely different machines, I ultimately decided to give the S10 a try.
So, here’s what I think,

Engine.
When it comes to power, the torque and horsepower of the Duc win hands down. Put the Multi in sport mode, twist the throttle, and you feel like you’ve been shot out of a cannon. The acceleration is just fantastic, and very hard to resist. The problem is that on the road, at least for me, it’s more than you can realistically use most of the time. It’s fun to twist it once in a while, but it’s just way more power than you need and can use on the street.
The S10 doesn’t have nearly the power of the Multi, but for me it has more than enough to enjoy. The Yamaha has more than enough to be fun in the real world. I think the power of the S10 is just about right for riding on the street.
I also find the character of the two motors to be completely different. The Duc isn’t happy unless it’s turning more than 4K rpms. My impression of the S10 is that it likes to run at about 4K. That seems to be the sweet spot.

Handling.
The Ducati handles like a sport bike. No complaints whatsoever. It’s a light bike for it’s size and power and it handles great. You can’t fault it.
The Yamaha is almost 100 lbs heavier but I am amazed at how well this bike handles. On paper the specs (weight, wheel size, etc…) make it seem like this bike would not handle as well as it does, but when you ride one you quickly learn that it handles very well. I’m very impressed and happy with my new Yamaha.

Comfort.
Comfort is subjective. It depends on personal preferences as well as a riders size.
For my tastes I didn’t find the Multi to be uncomfortable, but I didn’t love it for longer rides. The Multi seat really locks you in place and doesn’t let you move around at all. It works well for aggressive riding, but not so much for long distances.
On the other hand, I find the S10 to be one of the most comfortable bikes I’ve ever ridden. I even like the stock seat. It’s comfortable and has plenty of room to move around and change up your riding position. I can ride the bike all day with no complaints.

Summary.
The Multi works best when it’s ridden aggressively. It’s light for what it is, has tons of power, and it has lots of braking power. The motor isn’t happy until the rpms are up, so you always end up riding fast. It’s a very difficult bike to go slow on. It’s awesome on a twisty mountain road, but it’s hard to relax and enjoy the scenery on this bike. You just always go hard on the Duc.
The Yamaha seems to work better if you maintain a more even pace. The S10 handles well even in the twisties, and it has decent power, but since it’s heavier it seems to go better if you keep a steadier throttle through the curves. You don’t have to ride slower, you just don’t brake and accelerate quite as hard as you would on the Ducati.
Both bikes are marketed as “Adventure Bikes” capable of doing just about anything, but for me they are completely different machines. The Duc is a sportbike with tall suspension and an upright riding position.
The Yamaha is the better “all rounder”. It handles very well and has enough power to be a blast on the road. It makes a great touring bike, even if sport touring is what you’re looking for.
Although I can’t speak from experience, the S10 is clearly capable of pushing the limits of the adventure touring spectrum.
It was hard for me to give up the Multistrada even with the issues I was having. Initially I wasn’t sure the Super Tenere would work out for me, but after about 1500 miles I am very happy I bought the Yamaha. I think it’s a fantastic motorcycle.
 

MotoPumps

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Hey Jack-

I have 17k on my Super Ten and really like the bike, but have some grumbles here and there. I have ridden a Diavel, but not a Multi. That is a monster motor.

Tell us more about the issues you had with the Duc. I miss my Monster, but sold it when the local Ducati dealer closed. Have lusted since, but not bitten.

Thanks-

Rob
 

Combo

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Jack, Congrats on your new Tenere. Nice report on both bikes.

2+ years now and all we have done is tires, filters and oil. The wife and I love this bike. ::001::
 

mcrider007

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Very nice comparison, I rode a 2013 MS back to back with my S10 and would make the same comments. The MS is all engine with an awkward sitting position, however, the engine is only useful on the open highway at high speeds while you have to put up with the sitting position all the time.

The MS I rode had the new Skyhook suspension and it was the best electronic suspension I have ridden to date....but it wasn't any better than my S10 (Penske shock and linear fork springs), it just cost more...... a lot more. After an hour I was more than ready to get back on the S10, it's more comfortable and has all the power it needs to do what it is designed to do.
 

JackN

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MotoPumps said:
Hey Jack-

I have 17k on my Super Ten and really like the bike, but have some grumbles here and there. I have ridden a Diavel, but not a Multi. That is a monster motor.

Tell us more about the issues you had with the Duc. I miss my Monster, but sold it when the local Ducati dealer closed. Have lusted since, but not bitten.

Thanks-

Rob
The thing about the Multistrada is that if you test ride you will want one. They are that much fun to ride! You just need to know what you're getting into. There are some known issues with the bikes, some of which have been blown out of proportion, but some which are definitely real.
My issues were a leaking counter shaft seal (no biggie, warranteed), broken rear hugger (not a problem, warranteed), really shitty FI mapping (known issue Ducati did nothing about for anyone), and a defective dashboard (waranteed).
I also had my coolant replaced under warranty at no charge. I had no problems related to the coolant but many had issues with cylinder heads failing due to over heating. My dealer told me the issue was caused by defective coolant causing corrosion in the radiator which sometimes caused oxidized particles to block water channels. For me the real problem was that Ducati never acknowledged what was really going on. Many owners sold their bikes for fear that they'd face a huge repair bill if the head failure occurred after their warranty expired. I worried about that for quite a while but eventually decided I was ok and got over it.
The final issue I had was with the fuel tank. New Ducatis all have plastic fuel tanks. There is a very well known issue with Ducati fuel tanks failing due to ethanol exposure, yet Ducati still refuses to acknowledge the problem and continues to build bikes with plastic fuel tanks. Normally, they'll replace a damaged tank with little to no fuss, but sometimes they refuse to replace defective tanks. When my other Duc (GT 1000) tank failed Ducati flatly refused a replacement. It took months of effort to get a warranty replacement tank from Ducati. It actually took so long that I built a custom replacement tank for myself. Because of this experience I was extremely aware that I might have to deal with a defective fuel tank at some point. Nevertheless, even though my warranty ran out in June, I had decided to keep the bike. I was willing to take the chance on the bike because I enjoyed it so much. Then, about a month ago I realized that my Multi fuel tank had failed because of ethanol exposure. The tank had expanded so much that it damaged the body panels covering it.
My dealer was great about handling the issue and Ducati even agreed to warranty the problem, but for me the bad tank was the proverbial straw that broke the camels back. Assuming the tank had not been under warranty, the repair would have cost about $2300.00 for parts alone. I decided I was unwilling to risk any future repair bills of that magnitude.
I also decided, that at least for the time being, I was no longer willing to deal with Ducati's arrogance so I traded the Mutli for my new Yamaha.
 

JackN

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twinrider said:
Nice report Jack. I highly recommend the ECUnleashed Gen. II reflash. It really wakes the motor up and also makes it run much smoother. I got mine done at AF1 Racing. http://www.af1racing.com/store/Scripts/default.asp

Whereabouts in CT are you? I grew up in Farmington and cut my riding teeth there.
I may think about engine upgrades down the road, but for now I'm good with the S10 as it is. I really don't understand all the negative press the motor in this bike gets. Having said that, more HP and torque certainly can be a lot of fun! Thanks for the recommendation.
I'm in SE CT/ Mystic area.
 

twinrider

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JackN said:
I may think about engine upgrades down the road, but for now I'm good with the S10 as it is. I really don't understand all the negative press the motor in this bike gets. Having said that, more HP and torque certainly can be a lot of fun! Thanks for the recommendation.
I'm in SE CT/ Mystic area.
Nice, like every other CT school kid I did a field trip out to Mystic in the 70s... ::008::

I waited a while for the reflash, not a bad plan either because it makes it feel like a new bike all over again. ::012::
 

JackN

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mcrider007 said:
The MS I rode had the new Skyhook suspension and it was the best electronic suspension I have ridden to date....but it wasn't any better than my S10 (Penske shock and linear fork springs), it just cost more...... a lot more. After an hour I was more than ready to get back on the S10, it's more comfortable and has all the power it needs to do what it is designed to do.
My Multi was a Standard, no electronic suspension. I was concerned that the Ducati electronics would become an issue eventually. Plus, once the bike is set up I don't see the need to change it all the time. I think that good quality "normal" non electronic shocks are the way to go.
 

Rasher

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An ECu Unleashed flash gives a really good improvement to the low-midrange drive and throttle response, the sweet spot is still stacked in the 4-6k region, but it pulls a LOT harder (especially 1st - 3rd) and the throttle response is far more linear, but even in top gear it is quicker - and I am sure mine is also smoother, Oh and mpg has been improved by about 3mpg.

Arrow Headers will give a good top-end gain, the bike still feels like the power is stacked from 3k-6k, but the drive up to and beyond the redline is mucho improved, mine is about 10BHP up on stock with headers and flash - quite again, still no MTS beater, but in the real world most people spend at least 90% of their time in the mid-range so except when going for it in a straight line the bike will be a match for the "more powerful" adv bikes out there.

Handling and ground clearance can be very much improved, many folks (myself included) have reworked using linear springs, and I have also added a fully adjustable Wilburs shock, right away handling was improved, especially two-up where the OE shock struggled to cope and left the bike wallowing, running wide and running out of clearance when pushed in the twisties.

You could certainly buy a Tenere, Full Exhaust System, Remap, Shock, Fork rework for less than the cost of an MTS, and the bike would be so close to the Ducati in the real world, still not quite as quick, and maybe not quite as sweet handling on Tarmac, but more than good enough for 99% of riders needs.
 

creggur

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Thanks for the real-world, first-hand comparison! The Multi was the first adventure bike that caught my eye when I started looking, and after tons of research on the major players I landed on a Tenere due to reliability, dealer network, etc.

But what really sold me was a test ride. The Tenere just "felt" right when I rode it the first time. As far as the engine goes, yes, the Gen II Reflash is worth every penny, but you're really going to tell a difference once the miles start adding up. I swear mine was still breaking in the first 8,000+ miles. It really does continue to noticeably improve for that long. I just had the flash done at 12k and I consider it another leap forward.

Congrats on the new ride, and thanks again for taking the time to do the writeup!
 

thfraser

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I like Duc's and BMW's. They both have a ton of innovative technology. But they both also have limited dealer networks and when you push the tech envelope you sometimes suffer in the reliability area. Some folks never have a problem, some do. They also have limited dealer networks. I'm lucky that I live near some Ducati dealers, and at one time I seriously considered getting an ST2. However.... I went to the S10 for a few reasons. One, it was a bike that didn't necessarily do anything top notch, but it wasn't a slouch other. I also had a tremendious recommendation on the S10 from Sail2xxs. Then I test drove one, and was very impressed with how well it handled. I also found the stock suspension better than any other stock configured bike I have had in the past. And the performance worked for my needs.

So... with a big dealer network, a reputation for reliability, an ability to almost go anwhere, and low maintenance, it was pretty much a done deal. I bought the S10 and then sold my Tiger 1050. The Tiger is bike that has one heck of a motor, but the Triumph dealer network isn't that robust, and I had to take it 300 miles to find someone that knew and supported the bike to help me. Since then, a Triumph dealer just opened up a few miles from my house (go figure). In addition, the S10 is a much, much better bike off road. And I had a desire to go off road, but wanted something with low maintenance. I'm also tired of chains, not that they bother me, but I do like the convenience of a shaft drive.

So, almost 20k miles and almost a year later, I still dig the S10 and want to do more with it. Now if I could find someone super rich to support me and my family, I'd start going around the world on it.
 

GrahamD

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Thanks Jack,

About what I expected the differences were. You are not the only one to say similar things.

I still don't get the Ducati fuel tank thing though. I can understand Ducati being reluctant to take a hit with a mountain of tanks starring at them ON THE FIRST MODEL TO USE ONE, but to keep repeating the same mistake is a bit strange.

I am willing to forgive a company that tries to move innovation forward and gets caught with some unexpected gotchas, but when it is repeated on a fresh model, I'm sorry but that points to something else. Similar to the BMW shaft etc. Just keep repeating the same old thing and let the user pay MORE. Do they think the bike is so amazing that the expensive initial cost is a steal or something?

Anyway, yes they are different bikes. YAMAHA has gone out and made a ground up bike that is very general purpose, tough and safe with all the compromises that entails. If you look at the first add campaign you can see what they were doing.

Yamaha XT 1200: Take your soul everywhere and come back

At that stage the engineers and company had probably had the bike in many parts of the world and had got it as reliable as it could be. With the benefit of almost 4 years of hindsight and experience the add seems way more poignant now. They delivered.

Having said that though, it is good that there are so many different "compromises" out there. Everyone should be able to find their niche.

I hope the Ducati owners still talk to you, with that lowly Tenere ;D
 

GrahamD

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Boostedxt said:
the issue goes back to 2006. Everything in their line uses a plastic tank except the top race models and limited editions. Its not Ducati only and its not Ducati making the tanks. They outsourced the tanks to Acerbis and all companies who did that had issues. KTM, MV Agusta, Ducati, and even BMW have tank issues. If I were Ducati I would replace every single tank and then go after Acerbis for damages.
So what are you saying?

Everyone buys the same shitty tanks from a 2nd rate tank supplier so it's no competitive disadvantage to keep buying shit off Acerbis?

Wouldn't it be better after year 1 to go to aluminium or find another supplier. I am sure the R&D budget to get that happening would be way cheaper than a Lawyer fest.

This is probably why the Japanese do better.

Manufacturer goes to OEM supplier and expresses extreme disappointment from loss of face.
OEM supplier management then jump out of the 4th story window due to shame.
New management comes in and apologizes profusely for stuff up, problem solved.

Yes it's an old caricature but the Acerbis thing reeks of an entrenched old boys network, without any pride.

On the other hand it may just be the accountants and management knowing that it doesn't matter as long a people are coming back for more. It's not like the press are that serious about sticking it to the advertisers for this stuff.
 

JackN

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Boostedxt said:
the issue goes back to 2006. Everything in their line uses a plastic tank except the top race models and limited editions. Its not Ducati only and its not Ducati making the tanks. They outsourced the tanks to Acerbis and all companies who did that had issues. KTM, MV Agusta, Ducati, and even BMW have tank issues. If I were Ducati I would replace every single tank and then go after Acerbis for damages.
The thing is, regardless of actually manufacturers the tank, the spec comes from Ducati. They know what's going on, they know why the tanks are failing and yet they do NOTHING about it. They will normally replace a damaged tank, but they replace it with exactly the same thing, and then the problem occurs all over again. The craziest thing of all is if they just coated the inside of the tank with the proper material the whole issue would go away. I have to believe that would be much more cost effective for Ducati in the long run. Supplying multiple fuel tanks for a large percentage of the bikes they sell has got be very expensive.
It's an absolutely insane way to conduct business and treat their customers. This is the primary reason why I decided to replace my Multistrada when the tank failed.
 

motoguy

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Unless I missed something somewhere, I thought that it was a DOT standard that All motorcycles had to have a steel fuel tank for hwy use. For safty reasons alone, a bike sliding down the pavement with a plastic tank could be quite bad if you know what I mean.
 

Dallara

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motoguy said:
Unless I missed something somewhere, I thought that it was a DOT standard that All motorcycles had to have a steel fuel tank for hwy use. For safty reasons alone, a bike sliding down the pavement with a plastic tank could be quite bad if you know what I mean.


Nope. No current DOT or NHTSA regs requiring steel tanks. In fact, tons of cars these days use plastic tanks, too, and the general consensus is that they are much safer in most crashes... and that's on both cars and motorcycles. Plastic tanks are more likely to flex and deform, then return to shape, in the event of an impact, whereas steel and aluminum tanks are more like to crush and split. And any sliding on pavement that wold grind through most of today's plastic fuel tanks would grind right through a metal one as well. Today's plastic tanks also tend to be more puncture resistant in most cases, too,

You will probably see more and more plastic tanks in the future, not less.

Dallara



~
 

motoguy

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Dallara said:
Nope. No current DOT or NHTSA regs requiring steel tanks. In fact, tons of cars these days use plastic tanks, too, and the general consensus is that they are much safer in most crashes... and that's on both cars and motorcycles. Plastic tanks are more likely to flex and deform, then return to shape, in the event of an impact, whereas steel and aluminum tanks are more like to crush and split. And any sliding on pavement that wold grind through most of today's plastic fuel tanks would grind right through a metal one as well. Today's plastic tanks also tend to be more puncture resistant in most cases, too,

You will probably see more and more plastic tanks in the future, not less.

Dallara

~
Interesting, I always thought as far as the auto industry go's, the plastic tanks were just cheeper to make and for mx they were lighter.
My DRZ sm has a steel tank, figured it was the DOT thing. It does seem odd for the type of bike it is anyway.
 

GrahamD

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motoguy said:
Interesting, I always thought as far as the auto industry go's, the plastic tanks were just cheeper to make and for mx they were lighter.
My DRZ sm has a steel tank, figured it was the DOT thing. It does seem odd for the type of bike it is anyway.
I think the Japanese old boys club use steel because that's what they use. They may also be testing samples on a regular basis and throwing OEM executives out of windows.

Most of the problems I think are to do with the motorcycle requirements to have, not only a functional non swelling tank, but a good looking one as well. And with all things Italian they only have good looking and sexy on the Q&A checklist.

The Japanese have, long lasting, good looking and safe on the check list. The car tanks are hidden so no points for good looking so they can be made form anything that is safe and long lasting.

But I would have thought by now that a DR650 or KLR would have got past the good looking part. ;D
 
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