Might have a headlight problem.....I think!

[MIKE R]

My bike is a 2015 2nd generation so should not be affected by the headlight wiring harness problem.

On a ride today, my mate (who was riding in front) stopped and asked why I was continually flashing him, which I was not. Apparently my headlight main beam keeps coming on for a couple of seconds and then goes off just leaving the usual dipped beam.

We finished up riding for a short while with my friend in front raising his arm when my lights were 'flashing'. This was happening on a regular basis on bumpy back roads, but the blue main beam warning light didn't come on.

Any ideas? I'm starting to suspect that the relay is faulty and making an intermittent contact.

Mike

 

[Dogdaze]

Check the wiring harness behind the rhs cover, the connection plugs is by the fuse panel in a sheath, mine worked loose and I lost all my lights, luckily I had aux DRL on anyway.

 

[Checkswrecks]

Start by seeing if it's one light or both. A fractured filament can do this.

 

[MIKE R]

Good shout but apparently it's both lights. Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to replicate the problem in the garage. Must be linked to vibration.

Mike

 

[MIKE R]

Check the wiring harness behind the rhs cover, the connection plugs is by the fuse panel in a sheath, mine worked loose and I lost all my lights, luckily I had aux DRL on anyway.

Thanks for that but I am 'gaining' lights. not losing them. I will double check this area though as I have been fiddling here when my spots failed.

Mike

 

[Checkswrecks]

Good shout but apparently it's both lights. Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to replicate the problem in the garage. Must be linked to vibration.

Mike

Work some contact cleaner into the hi/low switch on the left cluster. It may take removal and opening of the cluster. The actual contacts are pretty simple copper sliding on each other.

 

[MIKE R]

Work some contact cleaner into the hi/low switch on the left cluster. It may take removal and opening of the cluster. The actual contacts are pretty simple copper sliding on each other.

Many thanks I'll give it a try but when the lights suddenly go onto high beam the blue warning light doesn't come on. Surely if the problem was emanating from the switch the blue idiot light would illuminate.

Mike

 

[Squibb]

Is your mate 100% sure it is the high beam he is seeing, not just your dip set a bit high flicking light is his mirrors as you crest a bump. Were you carrying luggage/pillion at the time? Was the rear suspension running low/soft damping? Dare I say, were you riding close behind your buddy?

Just a thought - I often saw this effect when a bike came up behind my old SLK, which didnt have an auto anti-dazzle system on the rear view mirror.

Personally, before ripping off panels to check wiring/relays etc, I would suggest taking the bike out on the darkest bumpiest road you can find tonight & taking careful note of the light show. If there is a fault in the switch, I too would have thought the idiot light would illuminate, or a least glimmer - presumably the switch action is normal? It might just be a case of increasing the rear preload, or adjusting the headlight beam. I run a 2014 ES, so suspension set up is pretty obvious, but I did need to adjust the aim of the headlights down quite some way when I first aquired my S10 to avoid dazzling other road users.

Sorry, if you have tried all this, just my 2 penny worth.

Ride Safe ..................... KEN

 

[Gigitt]

it could also be the side affect of projector headlight with a beam cut off.

every bump you hit the low beam cut off raises and he see the bright light, then the bike dips and he now see none...
it looks like high beam flicks on but in fact is he is seeing the low beam below the cut off as the bike bounces about.

same thing happens in cars.... next time you drive a car you will see same affect with all projector lights - more so when you are seating low in a car than high in a bike.

 

[caillou]

You probably already know that but the S10 does not have high / low beams. The H7 is high beam constantly and there is a flap cutting light when on low (BTW, when this flap fails, it costs a fortune). I believe the flap does have springs to keep it in low beam position and an electric motor to push it up. A problem with the flap would not turn high bean blue light on. Once you are sure there is a problem, have a look at the flap and make sure it works properly. You can hear the "clac" when switching low to high on idle.

 

[WJBertrand]

My '15 was delivered with the headlamps adjusted way too high. Flipping the high beams to on whilst riding a dark road, would actually give me less light on the road than low beam. It was great for checking the presence of spotted owls in the tree tops though. I would start by checking and adjusting headlight aim.


-Jeff

 

[MIKE R]

Many thanks for all your responses.

Squibb I have ridden with this friend for thousands of miles and he's never reported this before, so I trust his judgement although going for a night ride is an excellent idea.

The problem is not suspension related. I thought this could be the case and altered the setting between 'soft' and 'hard' (mine has electronic suspension) but the problem persisted. The problem was also evident on smooth A roads as well as bump back roads.

Luckily the bike is still under warranty so it's booked into my local Yamaha dealer on Wednesday. If I try fishing around I'll probably make matters worse!

Hopefully they'll find the problem and I can then report the solution on here. Might help someone else in the future.

Mike

 

[fred-houston]

My '15 was delivered with the headlamps adjusted way too high. Flipping the high beams to on whilst riding a dark road, would actually give me less light on the road than low beam. It was great for checking the presence of spotted owls in the tree tops though. I would start by checking and adjusting headlight aim.


-Jeff

+1

My 16 had the headlights adjusted so high you would think they were searching for UFO's. I have already adjusted them down twice, and may have to do it again. At least I have lights on the road now.

 

[WJBertrand]

+1

My 16 had the headlights adjusted so high you would think they were searching for UFO's. I have already adjusted them down twice, and may have to do it again. At least I have lights on the road now.

I don't think Yamaha figured in the weight of the average US rider because the rear spring is also too soft, especially on the ES. My headlight aim was solved by changing out the rear spring, so I could get a reasonable sag number that aligns with the graphic description of each loading condition, and by screwing the head light adjusters down more than just a couple of turns.

 

[MIKE R]

You probably already know that but the S10 does not have high / low beams. The H7 is high beam constantly and there is a flap cutting light when on low (BTW, when this flap fails, it costs a fortune). I believe the flap does have springs to keep it in low beam position and an electric motor to push it up. A problem with the flap would not turn high bean blue light on. Once you are sure there is a problem, have a look at the flap and make sure it works properly. You can hear the "clac" when switching low to high on idle.

Many thanks Caillou. I Can definitely hear the 'clac' when switching from low to high beam etc. I always thought that this was a relay working.

Anyway as I said earlier it's booked into my local Yam dealer on Wednesday. The mechanic there is very good and likes the occasional challenge!!!

Mike

 

[MIKE R]

UPDATE

Took the bike into the dealers today. Obviously it's a difficult job as the fault only happens when the bike is being ridden. They seem to think that my relay theory could be right and are ordering a new one from Yamaha which should be here early next week.
A road test will then tell us if the fault has been cured. If it has great ::001::, if not it'll have to go back into the workshop :'(.

Mike

 

[Squibb]

Without testing at night, they could just be chasing shadows Mike, so I trust Yamaha warranty is definitely paying.

I would have thought your dealer's approach would be to check your ES, to make sure it is dialling in the correct preload for the spring, through all it's settings, then the damping, making sure the ride heights front & rear are correct. Then check out the beam adjustment, with the appropriate load on the seat (I think the rider weight the system anticipates is around 90 Kg), as well as the flap action (which you said seems OK). As many of us have mentioned, the ES bikes appear to get delivered with the dip beam set way too high, so significant adjustment is needed to avoid dazzle. Yes, there could be a relay fault, yes the flap may be somehow .... flapping. But I think it is important to start at the beginnning, rather than jump straight to exploring electronic issues; an area where, in my experience, most dealers seem incredibly inept, even when they talk a good one.

Incidentally, just a thought - I seem to recall someone on here managed to get their ES out of sync by adjusting the ride height/load options incorrectly - see pages 3-37/8 of the Owner's manual. It is important that, with the engine running, there should be no weight on the bike when using the preload adjusting function. I can't seem to find the post right now, but maybe someone can chip in & help.

Anyway, your dealer may have addressed all this, so ignore me if they have.

My problem is that I have developed a deep seated mistrust of car & bike dealers over the years, at least when it comes to fixing issues like misfires, coils, fuelling stutters, warped discs or anything vaguely electronic. Some just don't want to expend the time needed to sort out issues methodically, so always seem to look for the quick fix, so they can send the customer on his/her way & kick the underlying issue into the long grass. Sounds a bit cynical I know, but believe me ........ I have been there.

Good luck with the fix.

Ride Safe ........................ KEN

 

[Gigitt]

One other thing to check... pull the rear caps off and see if you can move the internal light housing. If the housing has popped off the alignment pegs then any bump or jolt can move the housing inside the headlight and throw the beam up like you are flashing high beams.

Projector headlights generally run a hard shaft from the solenoid to the high beam shield and not use springs to hold the flap down.
For the flap to activate and move 12V DC has to be applied to the solenoid. I dont know how the S10 works as I waiting for my LED's to arrive before I pull the caps of to had a look inside.

A relay could be faulty... but these things are really pretty rugged, tapping the relay to jolt it might provide more clues if it is the cause.

 

[WJBertrand]

I suspect what's actually happening is that the adjustment is set too high and as you ride bumps, dips and rises in the road are causing intermittent exposure of the riders mirrors in front of you to the beam below the upper cut off line. If you stand in front of the bike with the lights on and slowly lower your view until your eyes are below the upper cut off - zowie, spots before your eyes!


-Jeff

 

[MIKE R]

Thanks again for your help and opinions.

I don't think it is suspension related because the friend who reported the fault to me has ridden with me (and the S10) for thousands of miles and not reported this issue before. I have also completed 2 European tours this year with an organised group. Approx 6k miles ridden in a group and no one has mentioned the issue. Having said that I could be wrong and if it proves to be the suspension I'll publically eat humble pie!

Your idea Gigitt is intriguing and certainly worth a look.

The bikes in my garage at the moment but I don't think I'll strip anything down until we find out what happens when the dealer replaces the relay. Although relays are very reliable by pure coincidence the relay to my spots failed a couple if months ago.

Thanks again and I'll keep you all informed

Mike