BMW recall 440,000 bikes....moments of appreciation

[Purificator81]

came across this piece of news:

BMW announces service campaign for 440,000 R 1200 GS and R 1250 GS bikes

BMW has announced a service campaign for over 400,000 of its R 1200 GS and R 1250 GS models to correct an issue relating to the cardan shaft.

www.visordown.com

not bashing BMW (who are standing behind their product as far as the shaft-drive is concerned at least) but...for so many years the supertenere is still there...bulletproof shaft-drive....pretty much like nowadays crisis where everyone seem to refocus on fundamental matters (growing its own wheat or food generally or having some sort of energy independence...or bringing jobs back in the home country etc...) it is always good to remember how lucky we are and focus on a trouble free riding experience and pure adventure....a bike that focuses on the fundamentals of what we are meant to look for...

ride safe

 

[Sierra1]

. . . . not bashing BMW (who are standing behind their product as far as the shaft-drive is concerned at least) . . . .

I guess that would be a "better late than never" for standing behind their product? How many shafts have broken? And they're putting it on air & moisture that can't get out? So, they're going to put another hole in the shaft, hope the valve works, and send you on your way? How about refunding the cost of a new shaft to everyone that had to have theirs repaired?

I don't know why this pisses me off so much. Not like I have to worry since I'm riding a Thunder Lizard. I guess it's the "pay more for less" that seems to be everywhere nowadays.

 

[WJBertrand]

What I can’t get over is, who’s been doing shaft drives longer than BMW? If anyone should have this figured out it should be them, right?


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[Sierra1]

What I can’t get over is, who’s been doing shaft drives longer than BMW? If anyone should have this figured out it should be them, right?

According to them they have. Another case of "just 'cuz you say it, doesn't make it true".

 

[RCinNC]

It took an awful lot of arm twisting from their customers to get them to even acknowledge the fork separation issue a few years ago, let alone address it.

As I look at my odometer that's just 9000 miles shy of 100,000 miles, knowing that I've never experienced a significant failure, I appreciate this bike and its stone axe reliability more every year.

 

[AZMike]

Yep

 

[Dons 1911]

I lost the drive shaft on my '05 R1200GS at 96k miles. Paid a dealer over $4200 to put a new shaft and tunnel (or swing arm or whatever it's called) on it. They assured me final drive was fine and replaced the fluid in it. I lost the final drive at 110k miles on a trip, almost 2k miles from home. They wanted another $4200 for a new Final Drive. Had the failed one rebuilt for around $1500. That bike was great but it was really starting to cost me money! I sold it at 137k miles and moved on. Like I said, it was a great bike and up until the driveshaft failure, it hadn't been much trouble. It is nice to see them taking care of this current issue.

 

[Purificator81]

I guess that would be a "better late than never" for standing behind their product? How many shafts have broken? And they're putting it on air & moisture that can't get out? So, they're going to put another hole in the shaft, hope the valve works, and send you on your way? How about refunding the cost of a new shaft to everyone that had to have theirs repaired?

I don't know why this pisses me off so much. Not like I have to worry since I'm riding a Thunder Lizard. I guess it's the "pay more for less" that seems to be everywhere nowadays.

I guess I was trying to be diplomatically correct in order to not be put in the box of "bmw bashers"...to add salt to injuries, I was told by a friend who contacted the local dealer about the recall and the dealer said the recall applies only to the bikes still under the name of the original buyer....I was shocked when he told me this....I hope it is not an easy way for the dealer to do less work.....speaking of which: making a hole in the shaft drive does not seem to be a genius solution anyway ‍

 

[Purificator81]

What I can’t get over is, who’s been doing shaft drives longer than BMW? If anyone should have this figured out it should be them, right?


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Yeah except is the design is flawed while the mindset of the maker is "it is perfect, they are wrong"

 

[Sierra1]

I lost the drive shaft on my '05 R1200GS at 96k miles. . . .

I guess I was trying to be diplomatically correct in order to not be put in the box of "bmw bashers"...to add salt to injuries, . . . .

My Beemer bashing is from personal experience, not hearsay. I feel that gives me the right. 'Cuz, like @Dons 1911, I too thought the RT was great. . . . until it wasn't. Which was shortly after the warranty expired, and not anywhere Don's mileage. But, I was on my third drive shaft, and fourth clutch. Ya' know, 'cuz the shaft takes out the clutch when it goes.

 

[Purificator81]

My Beemer bashing is from personal experience, not hearsay. I feel that gives me the right. 'Cuz, like @Dons 1911, I too thought the RT was great. . . . until it wasn't. Which was shortly after the warranty expired, and not anywhere Don's mileage. But, I was on my third drive shaft, and fourth clutch. Ya' know, 'cuz the shaft takes out the clutch when it goes.

Understood. I do visit regularly my friend who is running a repair shop for motorbikes...and most of the times he handles BMWs so while I did not have a BMW, I can at least attest of what I see as problems in the repair shop...not sure in which category it puts me but frankly I don't really care..

 

[StefanOnHisS10]

not bashing BMW

You don't have to, they can do that all by themselves.

 

[03A3KRH]

What I can’t get over is, who’s been doing shaft drives longer than BMW? If anyone should have this figured out it should be them, right?

Well, who’s been doing V twins longer than Harley and it took them at least 4 tries to get the oil pump right on the Milwaukee 8. Most manufacturers are no longer interested in building the best possible product or providing a customer with great value, it’s more about maximizing profitability. It’s not the engineer’s fault as they have better tools for design now than ever before. Rather it’s the leadership, investor demands and the business culture that drives marginal designs with zero safety factors

 

[RCinNC]

I lost a lot of faith in BMW because of their manner of dealing with issues on their bikes, not so much the bikes themselves. As I mentioned in my earlier post, several years ago there was an issue with fork separation on certain models of BMW R1200GS's. Now, I think anyone who rides would have to agree that a fork coming apart while you're riding could be pretty catastrophic. BMW admits to first being aware of this issue in March 2016. Over the next four months, they received 107 reports of fork separations on these particular model years. They made no effort to notify owners of this issue, nor did they tell their service departments worldwide to specifically inspect for it. Between July and November 2016, BMW became aware of at least 8 more incidents of this fork separation; two incidents of fork separation resulted in two crashes, four incidents of fork separation were possibly the cause of four crashes, and two incidents of fork separation couldn't be determined as a cause of a crash.

In February 2017, BMW reported that 200 bikes in Germany and South Africa were checked and it was found that a fork gap separation was "possible". Encompassing total cases of gaps, total separation, and “potential for gap formation”, BMW was aware of over 300 incidents of this issue in varying degrees. This is now 12 months into BMW being aware of this issue, yet they still hadn't made any attempt to notify affected owners, or to issue any sort of maintenance directive to their service departments in the field to deliberately inspect for this issue. It wasn't until April 2017 that they finally issued a maintenance directive to their service departments to be on the lookout for this issue, and it took until mid July 2017 for BMW to order a stop sale for the affected model years of the bike, (which would be the first actual public notification of the problem). It wasn't until July 19, 2017, that they finally issued an actual recall.

BMW was aware of a potentially catastrophic issue with their bikes, with over 300 reported examples of failure and potential failure, for about 17 months before they actually informed their customers that of this issue, and took steps to fix it. That's freaking ridiculous.

I learned all this because years ago I posted a link about the stop sale on a motorcycle forum, and was immediately met with the standard "You're just a hater" comments from some fanboys who wouldn't stand for anything critical being said about BMW. I personally had no ill feelings about the brand, and actually liked their older airheads. I didn't want to argue without supporting facts, so I did a lot of research into the documents provided by BMW itself, and the NHTSA, which is where I obtained my figures. All that information is still out there on the net.

It's one thing to be a huge fan of a brand of bike, it's another to be a cultish apologist for one. I never did research into the final drive problems with the GS series, but I've certainly heard enough anecdotal stories about them to at the very least formulate an opinion about their accuracy. If you couple that anecdotal experience with what I learned about the fork issue from BMW's own documentation, then I don't know how anyone can still blindly claim that BMW is awesome and everyone who has issues with the company is just jealous of their success. If this happened with Yamaha, as much as I love my S10, you can believe I wouldn't be standing up for Yamaha's less than stellar response to the problem.

I like BMWs. I think they're great looking, powerful, and push a lot of cutting edge technology. But their corporate philosophy that sounds a lot like "you should be happy we let you buy this bike, so stop whinging" leaves a lot to be desired.

I mean, come on...how on earth can someone like Sierra1 be on their third drive shaft on a modern motorcycle built with modern tech, by a company that's been making bikes since before WWII? What does that tell you about the corporate structure behind the company that makes it?

 

[Purificator81]

I lost a lot of faith in BMW because of their manner of dealing with issues on their bikes, not so much the bikes themselves. As I mentioned in my earlier post, several years ago there was an issue with fork separation on certain models of BMW R1200GS's. Now, I think anyone who rides would have to agree that a fork coming apart while you're riding could be pretty catastrophic. BMW admits to first being aware of this issue in March 2016. Over the next four months, they received 107 reports of fork separations on these particular model years. They made no effort to notify owners of this issue, nor did they tell their service departments worldwide to specifically inspect for it. Between July and November 2016, BMW became aware of at least 8 more incidents of this fork separation; two incidents of fork separation resulted in two crashes, four incidents of fork separation were possibly the cause of four crashes, and two incidents of fork separation couldn't be determined as a cause of a crash.

In February 2017, BMW reported that 200 bikes in Germany and South Africa were checked and it was found that a fork gap separation was "possible". Encompassing total cases of gaps, total separation, and “potential for gap formation”, BMW was aware of over 300 incidents of this issue in varying degrees. This is now 12 months into BMW being aware of this issue, yet they still hadn't made any attempt to notify affected owners, or to issue any sort of maintenance directive to their service departments in the field to deliberately inspect for this issue. It wasn't until April 2017 that they finally issued a maintenance directive to their service departments to be on the lookout for this issue, and it took until mid July 2017 for BMW to order a stop sale for the affected model years of the bike, (which would be the first actual public notification of the problem). It wasn't until July 19, 2017, that they finally issued an actual recall.

BMW was aware of a potentially catastrophic issue with their bikes, with over 300 reported examples of failure and potential failure, for about 17 months before they actually informed their customers that of this issue, and took steps to fix it. That's freaking ridiculous.

I learned all this because years ago I posted a link about the stop sale on a motorcycle forum, and was immediately met with the standard "You're just a hater" comments from some fanboys who wouldn't stand for anything critical being said about BMW. I personally had no ill feelings about the brand, and actually liked their older airheads. I didn't want to argue without supporting facts, so I did a lot of research into the documents provided by BMW itself, and the NHTSA, which is where I obtained my figures. All that information is still out there on the net.

It's one thing to be a huge fan of a brand of bike, it's another to be a cultish apologist for one. I never did research into the final drive problems with the GS series, but I've certainly heard enough anecdotal stories about them to at the very least formulate an opinion about their accuracy. If you couple that anecdotal experience with what I learned about the fork issue from BMW's own documentation, then I don't know how anyone can still blindly claim that BMW is awesome and everyone who has issues with the company is just jealous of their success. If this happened with Yamaha, as much as I love my S10, you can believe I wouldn't be standing up for Yamaha's less than stellar response to the problem.

I like BMWs. I think they're great looking, powerful, and push a lot of cutting edge technology. But their corporate philosophy that sounds a lot like "you should be happy we let you buy this bike, so stop whinging" leaves a lot to be desired.

I mean, come on...how on earth can someone like Sierra1 be on their third drive shaft on a modern motorcycle built with modern tech, by a company that's been making bikes since before WWII? What does that tell you about the corporate structure behind the company that makes it?

Very moving story here...a lot of expectation for the price you paid vs the service and care received....in few years from now probably we will see a rear shock absorber recall...many ones started having issues but again given the time it takes BMW to admit something..who knows...

Yamaha did a recall for the light harness and it was quick and smooth...such an attention to the details and the care about the customers is such comforting...

Again the fundamental is the ride and doing adventure without the headache of mechanical or electronical issues....when BMW started offering extended warranty I found it to be funny because if you get a brakedown somewhere in the mountains or remote areas...it takes a hell of headache and money to get the bike down to the closest town...like the case of the Spanish rider who's rear shock went bust in the atlas mountains...

Thank you Yamaha for this piece of mind....will continue riding the 2012 I have forever...

 

[WJBertrand]

Besides the matter of how the fork separation issue was handled is the engineering/design of the failure point itself. The top of the fork tubes were secured via crimp type process. Their FEA data surely told them this was adequate. Real world use evidently showed it was not.

As a career scientist/engineer, It’s pretty common knowledge that any FEA model prediction needs validation testing in the real world under actual use (and abuse) conditions. These kinds of engineering and design gaffs are classically symptomatic of over confidence in an FEA model. One, even minor, missed factor can trash your entire model. BTDT and have been completely flummoxed at the real world failure. In medical devices we’re regulatory required to validation of any models before commercial approval can be obtained, so these kinds of things reaching market are rare.

I suspect the Germans were reluctant to accept their model was inadequate. Such an attitude leads to blaming others, like the customer, for misusing the product outside the parameters they input to their cherished computer model. This leads to a delay in response as the engineers, designers or penny pinchers must slowly accept having to swallow their pride.


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[TenereJourneyMan]

I lost a lot of faith in BMW because of their manner of dealing with issues on their bikes, not so much the bikes themselves. As I mentioned in my earlier post, several years ago there was an issue with fork separation on certain models of BMW R1200GS's. Now, I think anyone who rides would have to agree that a fork coming apart while you're riding could be pretty catastrophic. BMW admits to first being aware of this issue in March 2016. Over the next four months, they received 107 reports of fork separations on these particular model years. They made no effort to notify owners of this issue, nor did they tell their service departments worldwide to specifically inspect for it. Between July and November 2016, BMW became aware of at least 8 more incidents of this fork separation; two incidents of fork separation resulted in two crashes, four incidents of fork separation were possibly the cause of four crashes, and two incidents of fork separation couldn't be determined as a cause of a crash.

In February 2017, BMW reported that 200 bikes in Germany and South Africa were checked and it was found that a fork gap separation was "possible". Encompassing total cases of gaps, total separation, and “potential for gap formation”, BMW was aware of over 300 incidents of this issue in varying degrees. This is now 12 months into BMW being aware of this issue, yet they still hadn't made any attempt to notify affected owners, or to issue any sort of maintenance directive to their service departments in the field to deliberately inspect for this issue. It wasn't until April 2017 that they finally issued a maintenance directive to their service departments to be on the lookout for this issue, and it took until mid July 2017 for BMW to order a stop sale for the affected model years of the bike, (which would be the first actual public notification of the problem). It wasn't until July 19, 2017, that they finally issued an actual recall.

BMW was aware of a potentially catastrophic issue with their bikes, with over 300 reported examples of failure and potential failure, for about 17 months before they actually informed their customers that of this issue, and took steps to fix it. That's freaking ridiculous.

I learned all this because years ago I posted a link about the stop sale on a motorcycle forum, and was immediately met with the standard "You're just a hater" comments from some fanboys who wouldn't stand for anything critical being said about BMW. I personally had no ill feelings about the brand, and actually liked their older airheads. I didn't want to argue without supporting facts, so I did a lot of research into the documents provided by BMW itself, and the NHTSA, which is where I obtained my figures. All that information is still out there on the net.

It's one thing to be a huge fan of a brand of bike, it's another to be a cultish apologist for one. I never did research into the final drive problems with the GS series, but I've certainly heard enough anecdotal stories about them to at the very least formulate an opinion about their accuracy. If you couple that anecdotal experience with what I learned about the fork issue from BMW's own documentation, then I don't know how anyone can still blindly claim that BMW is awesome and everyone who has issues with the company is just jealous of their success. If this happened with Yamaha, as much as I love my S10, you can believe I wouldn't be standing up for Yamaha's less than stellar response to the problem.

I like BMWs. I think they're great looking, powerful, and push a lot of cutting edge technology. But their corporate philosophy that sounds a lot like "you should be happy we let you buy this bike, so stop whinging" leaves a lot to be desired.

I mean, come on...how on earth can someone like Sierra1 be on their third drive shaft on a modern motorcycle built with modern tech, by a company that's been making bikes since before WWII? What does that tell you about the corporate structure behind the company that makes it?

Hey RCinNC,

Thank you for adding more light to the situation. If I was a BMW owner, I would be very pissed. Thankfully, I will never be a BMW owner. This is because I have found too much joy with the ownership experience provided by Yamaha, throughout my entire life (along with some excellent experience with Hondas along the way). But, that is the definition of Cult, behavior. “Drink the Kool-Aid and then Repeat the Rhetoric”. That’s my quote, please feel free to use it. LOL

 

[WJBertrand]

It’s almost like some weird kind of Stockholm Syndrome…


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[TenereJourneyMan]

It’s almost like some weird kind of Stockholm Syndrome…


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Exactly!!! Well put!

 

[Checkswrecks]

Super Tenere = The BMW Recovery Vehicle