Will you take the vaccine

[WJBertrand]

My doc, a very well known immunologist, has recommended I wait for the second gen vaccine. He said, "The first round of vaccines historically has the highest chance of side effects and the lowest effectiveness. Wait."

Though we'll certainly learn more about any potential long term effects by waiting, I seriously doubt that a second gen vaccine will have better than the 95%+ effectiveness these 1st gen versions are showing. That's a really high level, even for established vaccines that have probably had multiple generations of development over decades. At levels of effectiveness this high, individual patient factors may be much more important, for example people with weak immune systems and attendant responses. Those variables will likely prevent any vaccine reaching 100% effectiveness.

 

[Checkswrecks]

As part of Operation Warp Speed the Feds already bought several hundred million doses of the several different vaccines. So the vaccine will be free. However there may be a small $5-10 fee to administer it depending on where you get it.

That will be true WHEN the meds developed by Warpspeed come out, but till at least Thursday (3 days from now) there aren't any, because the lone US vaccine so far was developed by Pfizer totally on their own. Moderna is expected to be approved on Thursday. This is separate from he treatments previously approved, like the one from Ely Lilly in November.

The Administration turned down an option to buy millions of Pfizer doses last July and there were so many other buyers that the current Pfizer deliveries we see on the news are commercial, to hospitals, States, cities, etc. An option is not a commitment, so it made zero sense but that's history at this point. Pfizer is one of the biggest international pharma companies and also is making the vaccine in Europe, so having turned down their offer to sell options to the US Govt of course freed up Pfizer to market the product they developed with their own money. However, now that the Pfizer doses are approved, the Administration has tried to tell the company that they could only sell the doses made in the US within our borders. As I understand, the doses made here in the US have been pre-sold mainly to domestic deliveries, so it isn't too big a problem for the company and of course they will sell every dose they make anyway. That still doesn't mean it is the Federal Govt buying the doses for Operation Warpspeed, plus has complicated distribution that was already planned for Canada, Mexico, and other allies.

 

[Checkswrecks]

My doc, a very well known immunologist, has recommended I wait for the second gen vaccine. He said, "The first round of vaccines historically has the highest chance of side effects and the lowest effectiveness. Wait."

My daughter is part of the development and originally said to wait too. She's changed position because of how things are developing and now says that by the time it is available, just get it. Her reasoning is that by a month or two from now there will have been so many people getting it (in the millions already) that any potential side effects and groups to avoid it will be well known.

 

[Kruzzin5]

Though we'll certainly learn more about any potential long term effects by waiting, I seriously doubt that a second gen vaccine will have better than the 95%+ effectiveness these 1st gen versions are showing. That's a really high level, even for established vaccines that have probably had multiple generations of development over decades. At levels of effectiveness this high, individual patient factors may be much more important, for example people with weak immune systems and attendant responses. Those variables will likely prevent any vaccine reaching 100% effectiveness.

Agreed. If anything, Pfizer may be able to make product improvements such as storage in lower temperatures, one dose required.

 

[AusTexS10]

If I don't take a vaccine and test negative then what is the problem?

In terms of testing negative, the efficacy of that result depends on whether or not you follow the recommended testing protocol. Because a negative finding currently only has a 70% probability of being correct (i.e., 30% false negatives), the recommended medical protocol is to follow up within 24 hours with another test. If you get two negatives in that period, it reduces the false negative probability to 5%. So, a random singular test negative result may not mean that much, certainly not enough to write home about. But writing home is a better option than going home relying on a false negative and passing the virus along to family and friends. That's the problem.

 

[AusTexS10]

Surely you’re not suggesting that we get injected with bull semen?


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Would it be more or less effective than the suggestion someone unnamed made to inject bleach?

 

[Sierra1]

And, to whomever took him seriously. . . . I still have a few acres for sale in Florida.

 

[WJBertrand]

Would it be more or less effective than the suggestion someone unnamed made to inject bleach?

I think that was some media “personality” making things up.


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[Tenman]

I see the percentages are going down for Yes on the pole. WTF

 

[WJBertrand]

One thing to consider for the scaredy cats out there; by the time the vaccines reach the general population there will have been millions and millions of additional data points.


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[fac191]

Love or hate your leader(s), I think it's hard to place the blame on them. A leader of a country is only as good as his cabinet/advisors. In New Zealand's case, it was a case of "size matters". Where, in this instance, smaller was better. Add in the fact that access to the country can be controlled pretty well. Y'all have 5.1-ish million people. California, alone, has eight times that, and open borders. And, you know us, "nobody's going to tell me what to do". . . . whereas your citizens knew what was good for them, and did it.

When this first started, and people here had at least a little fear of it, we were doing what was right, and the numbers were dropping. Texas was below 5% infection rate, and dropping. But, Memorial Day arrived, signaling summer was here. Even then we got the surge going back down, and then. . . . Labor Day, and some more business started back up. . . . and it was out of control from there. Without the vax, everybody in the U.S. will get it sooner or later, because you're not going to tell us what to do.

Or our leaders are as good as the tiny amount of people not elected who tell them what they want, and get it.

 

[OldRider]

Would it be more or less effective than the suggestion someone unnamed made to inject bleach?

I don't recall anyone ever saying that. Do you have a link for that?

 

[MattR]

I see the percentages are going down for Yes on the pole. WTF

Really? I can’t see the pole on my phone.

Maybe the more information you give people the more they disbelieve it?

Maybe you just can’t educate pork?


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[WJBertrand]

I don't recall anyone ever saying that. Do you have a link for that?

The only folks who said that were TV "news" personalities and they really twisted what Trump actually said. I watched the broadcast where one of Trump's expert's talked about the kinds of things that were effective at killing the virus. He was talking about in the environment. The expert talked about UV light, and disinfectants (not even mentioning bleach specifically). Trump turned to the experts and asked if there was any way to apply these things to treating people directly. He certainly asked an ignorant question (can't defend that) but there was no recommendation of any kind made. The question appeared to catch the experts in the room a bit off guard so he followed up asking them to look into it.

Of course the press latched on to it and twisted his question into a public recommendation and immediately published things like; "Trump says we should all do this" they completely fabricated the bit about injecting bleach. The whole thing then went viral and the facts were lost.

 

[Sierra1]

It's a percentage thing. With a small amount of responses, each vote carries more weight. Each vote is worth more than 1%. (74 votes = 100%. . . . . 100 votes = 100%, etc, etc)

 

[PhilPhilippines]

The only folks who said that were TV "news" personalities and they really twisted what Trump actually said. I watched the broadcast where one of Trump's expert's talked about the kinds of things that were effective at killing the virus. He was talking about in the environment. The expert talked about UV light, and disinfectants (not even mentioning bleach specifically). Trump turned to the experts and asked if there was any way to apply these things to treating people directly. He certainly asked an ignorant question (can't defend that) but there was no recommendation of any kind made. The question appeared to catch the experts in the room a bit off guard so he followed up asking them to look into it.

Of course the press latched on to it and twisted his question into a public recommendation and immediately published things like; "Trump says we should all do this" they completely fabricated the bit about injecting bleach. The whole thing then went viral and the facts were lost.

I'm sorry but, colour it any shade you want, it was a moronic question that nobody with an enormous..., erm brain, would ever ask.

Don't get me wrong. We have the Eton Mess in the yUK and Durtyturd here in the Pheeelypeens. All three are light years away from normalcy.

 

[WJBertrand]

I'm sorry but, colour it any shade you want, it was a moronic question that nobody with an enormous..., erm brain, would ever ask.

Don't get me wrong. We have the Eton Mess in the yUK and Durtyturd here in the Pheeelypeens. All three are light years away from normalcy.

Did you read my post? We don't disagree about the question. My point was that it was never a recommendation to "inject bleach". That was either social media or news media invention. There's no colors here.

 

[fac191]

I don't recall anyone ever saying that. Do you have a link for that?

Thats more of an African church deal. We have a guy in London who sell it through his church. Praise the Lord for peoples stupidity.

 

[Boris]

I see the percentages are going down for Yes on the pole. WTF

Am quite shocked at that.

Maybe due to the chavs not getting anything free out of it, or their mate Wayne from down the pub reckons......

 

[OldRider]

The only folks who said that were TV "news" personalities and they really twisted what Trump actually said. I watched the broadcast where one of Trump's expert's talked about the kinds of things that were effective at killing the virus. He was talking about in the environment. The expert talked about UV light, and disinfectants (not even mentioning bleach specifically). Trump turned to the experts and asked if there was any way to apply these things to treating people directly. He certainly asked an ignorant question (can't defend that) but there was no recommendation of any kind made. The question appeared to catch the experts in the room a bit off guard so he followed up asking them to look into it.

Of course the press latched on to it and twisted his question into a public recommendation and immediately published things like; "Trump says we should all do this" they completely fabricated the bit about injecting bleach. The whole thing then went viral and the facts were lost.

I knew he never said that. I just like to ask for links when someone post something untrue. They were talking about bleach killing the virus and Trump said it would be nice if we had "something like that" for humans.