Who has stiffened up there suspension?

[~TABASCO~]

Second day I brought it home I knocked down the compression a few notches and tweaked the rebound on the rear.. Ive noticed that over the last week I have dust marks about one inch from the bottom of the forks... I dont "think" I have ridden the bike that hard.. But I gotta play with the suspension this week and make it stiffer. Has anyone started to stiffen it up? Anyone find a good set up yet as a base?

On my FJR I have played with it for a few years and tweaked the oil but its just about as stiff as it will go, and out in the heavy duty twisters on the East Coast I can punish the suspension past its limits, but around here in TX its great.

 

[Firefight911]

Hey hotsauce, err, Tobasco...

"Base settings" on any suspension is quite exclusive to the individual. It is probably best to first figure out your base and then go from there. This all starts with first determining whether your ready to ride weight falls within the proper spring set up on the bike. If you are heavier than the spring rate set up on your bike there is no setting that will adequately create a proper handling motorcycle. Likewise, if you are lighter than the supplied set up. Most modern bikes are coming with spring rates for an approximately 185 pound rider. I do not currently know the spec of the spring rates provided on our bikes as I haven't delved in yet. That is coming this week now that my 9 day work marathon is winding down.

Once this has been determined you need to set the bike up with its static sag settings. This is done with you on the bike, ready to ride, and is usually set to put either end of the bike to a position that allows the bike, fully weighted and upright with you on it, to statically utilize between 25-33% of the available travel of the suspension. Our steeds have 7.48 inches on both the front and rear so you are looking for somewhere in between 1.875 inches and 2.475 inches of static sag at either end. I made my math easy and used 7.5 inches for my quick calculations.

If you know that you tend to like a firmer suspension hedge closer to 1.875 and of you tend to like a softer suspension hedge toward 2.475.

Once you have this you should set your compression and rebound on the front and rebound on the rear at their mid points and you can now begin as this is now considered YOUR base setting.

Understand that if you find you need a different spring rate more than one step from the stock set up, up or down, your compression and rebound settings won't be optimum as the shim stacks for the valving are not set properly due to the different springs you have installed and the oil height and weight may not be optimum either. For the most part, unless you are super anal and/or planning on going to a track you will find an adequate setting but understand that regardless of what you do suspension is a compromise.

Identify a section of road that is going to be representative of your normal and most often ridden in/on type of road whether that be on road, off road, smooth pavement, choppy, etc. This is now your personal test track.

Get yourself a log book, log every single thing you do starting with your above base settings.

Go ride and make mental note of what you are feeling. Sharp hit jolts, wallowing, packing, running wide, difficult turn in. Depending on what you already know as it relates to suspension set up you will have an idea as to what to do next. If you feel limited on your skill set as to what an adjustment does then go back out after moving ONE adjuster to the extreme of its adjustment range, ride, repeat analysis. Now take that adjustment and go to the opposite end of its adjustment and feel the change when you ride, repeat. Do this for all available adjustments, write the feeling from each individual one in your log book, and you now have an excellent resource and base to what you are doing when you adjust your suspension.

Return all the settings to YOUR base and you can now start to go out and ride your "test track" to make your bike handle and perform like you want it.

Google up suspension set up, etc. and you will find a plethora of information and ways to go about getting your bike dialed. I will reiterate the most important thing I can about suspension, write it down and log every single change you make. Make only ONE adjustment at a time and understand what that has done before moving on to the next.

Suspension is looked at, quite wrongly, as some form of black magic and a black art but, in reality, if you have an afternoon and one good assistant to help with your static set up and its measurements you will find it is nothing remotely approaching that.

The below link is one outstanding book to understand most everything suspension you never wanted to know and needed to know;

http://www.cycleconnections.com/articledetail.asp?TypeID=33&ID=1384

I also plan in the future to be contacting the below suspension guru when I go with my rebuild. I am around 220 pounds ready to ride so I know I am beyond the rate range supplied stock for my Tenere. SuperPlush is a KTM Adventure pro and I have no doubt that he will soon start down the road of looking at our Tenere since they perform similar duty and have similar suspension types.

http://www.superplushsuspension.com/

 

[~TABASCO~]

Thanks bud. I'm about 180. Going to mess with it this week.

 

[roy]

I had to soften mine on the front.

I full line off front preload, 2 clicks of compression out

Rear I had to stiffen after adding the oem cases and racks

4 clicks of preload added

3 clicks in on rebound

So far that is working good for me, I am 155 lbs.

 

[jajpko]

I had to soften mine on the front.

I full line off front preload, 2 clicks of compression out

Rear I had to stiffen after adding the oem cases and racks

4 clicks of preload added

3 clicks in on rebound

So far that is working good for me, I am 155 lbs.

Did you zero yours first, and then set the base? I did this and found the forks were not equal..

 

[Bill310]

I have not yet picked up my bike as the front forks are at Traxxion Dynamics getting their cartridge system installed. This will no doubt be an expensive but noteworthy upgrade for the Tenere and based on my past experience will be one of the preferred upgrades but costly enough to create argumentatv dissention in the forum

I had a custom valved and sprung Ohlins built in February and waiting for the bike.

I m 6'4" 250 with gear and know that the stock suspension won't be satisfactory for my needs.

I expect to pick up my bike early in September and won't be able to do much in the way of comparison reporting because once the suspension is tuned and the sag set I expect that the motorcycle will just ride well with no drama. This is of course the objective of good suspension setup and since stock components are shite compared to aftermarket upgrades I won't have much to add to any discussion on the topic.

 

[roy]

Did you zero yours first, and then set the base? I did this and found the forks were not equal..

yes

 

[nankoweap]

i'm a bog ol' boy and one of the first things i do is stiffen the suspension. the second thing i do is figure out what i need to do to suspension to make it big-boy ready. i haven't gotten around to the second thing yet.

i tightened the rear and haven't touched the front end.

 

[Bill310]

Hey Jason,

I will fill you in on how the Traxxion works out. Traxxion had to get custom length springs wound which added a delay to the build because the Tenere fork springs are quite long. I expect this will be an excellent setup.

Bill

i'm a bog ol' boy and one of the first things i do is stiffen the suspension. the second thing i do is figure out what i need to do to suspension to make it big-boy ready. i haven't gotten around to the second thing yet.

i tightened the rear and haven't touched the front end.

 

[SisuTen]

An excellent source of information regarding suspension tuning is:

"Sportbike Suspension Tuning" by Andrew Trevitt

Probably more than most on this forum actually needs, but it's a good read and it helps at times to listen to the pros and understand the process.

S-Ten

 

[nankoweap]

I will fill you in on how the Traxxion works out. Traxxion had to get custom length springs wound which added a delay to the build because the Tenere fork springs are quite long. I expect this will be an excellent setup.

Thanks, Bill. I would be willing to go the Traxxion route at this point in the bike's life and with the confidence that the bike's going to remain in the garage for a long time.

 

[Tremor38]

I understand that there's a chance these mod's are necessary based upon your weight alone..but, isn't that kinda like having your food served, then and adding a bunch of salt and spices before you even taste it? By most accounts, this bike has a pretty formidable suspension to start with.

I have not yet picked up my bike as the front forks are at Traxxion Dynamics getting their cartridge system installed. This will no doubt be an expensive but noteworthy upgrade for the Tenere and based on my past experience will be one of the preferred upgrades but costly enough to create argumentatv dissention in the forum

I had a custom valved and sprung Ohlins built in February and waiting for the bike.

I m 6'4" 250 with gear and know that the stock suspension won't be satisfactory for my needs.

I expect to pick up my bike early in September and won't be able to do much in the way of comparison reporting because once the suspension is tuned and the sag set I expect that the motorcycle will just ride well with no drama. This is of course the objective of good suspension setup and since stock components are shite compared to aftermarket upgrades I won't have much to add to any discussion on the topic.

 

[3putt]

I'm 180 also, and found the forks to be over stiff. I backed all the way off the preload and dampening over time, think I am a bit loose on dampening now, but never even get close to using the complete travel (I keep a ziptie on a fork). My rider sag is barely 38mm which is still too stiff.

On the other hand the shock/spring is about right, I run it about neutral for me and then a mark or more stiff for luggage or 2up. Sag is 55mm or so, I have it written down somewhere here.

The first week I was about to pull the forks and check the oil level in them, but have gotten used to it over time or it feels better now, not sure.

 

[Bill310]

Well, it just is easier to get it done right from the start. This isn't my first rodeo.

The odds that the stock suspension won't work as well as it can when the range of riders buying the bike will be beween 130 and 300 pounds with some adding two up riding and others carrying the kitchen sink is unlikey.

It would be interesting each time someone posts about the benefits of the stock suspension over custom built for the rider aftermarket suspension if the poster started out their comments by stating how many times they have had aftermarket suspension built for their bikes.

This is a general comment not directed at anyone in particular, but until you have actually ridden a bike with top quality suspension built for you and set up for your riding style the comments questioning the merits or values of aftermarket suspension are not based on fact but rather an opinion derived from th internet.

So how much does it cost to buy top of the line aftermarket suspension for the Tenere ?

The rear Ohlins will be about 900 - 1000 and the front Traxxion kit installed will be in the range of 1200 dollars. Setup for sag etc will likely be under $200

I hope that helps.

I understand that there's a chance these mod's are necessary based upon your weight alone..but, isn't that kinda like having your food served, then and adding a bunch of salt and spices before you even taste it? By most accounts, this bike has a pretty formidable suspension to start with.

 

[bloke]

the stock works ok but nothin beats having proper suspenders but you gotta ask yourself do you really need it?

i run the back end super stiff but im 285lb and dont have any bags rear pegs or anything back there, the front on the stock settings with me on paters mid corner when your giving it the berries so i dont see any point making it harder although i messed with re bound a little and kinda dialed it out a tad, for what it is it works great, sometimes i wish makers wouldnt put adjusters on bikes, after 20 odd years of running track days ive seen some real oddly set up bikes that were way worse than they would have been if they were stock!

if you dont understand suspension and how it works best leave it alone

 

[20valves]

I understand that there's a chance these mod's are necessary based upon your weight alone..but, isn't that kinda like having your food served, then and adding a bunch of salt and spices before you even taste it? By most accounts, this bike has a pretty formidable suspension to start with.

I think you're right tremor but this guy is way out on the ends of the range for stock springs. But yeah, even though I have the full Ohlins set up on my R1's, I'm quite sure Ben Spies could smoke me on a racetrack on a stock 1999 R6.

As for me, at 190 lbs., I came off two clicks of compression on the front and upped the rear preload one line and added a click more or rebound and had both ends working together nicely around town and on the road. That's one key of good susp set up, get both ends behaving well together.

Now that I have it loaded up for a trip, I took the rear preload to a half line off max, added another click of rebound, added a click of comp to the front, wound in another line of preload on the front and one more click of rebound.

Like most new Yams, upgrade suspension is always welcome but the stock stuff is at least worth wearing out as you get to know the bike.

 

[Twisties]

In riding gear I am probably 240 lbs, with side cases mounted but not much in them the stock settings are just fine for me for aggressive street riding (mountains). I found them a little stiff for compliant dirt riding. I would hesitate to go over a big rock or ledge that way.

Today I loaded it for the first time. Full side and top cases plus two dry bags, tank bag. I'm saying 120 lbs. The front was fine. I added some preload on the rear. Didn't go very far. Load was not secure and too top heavy. Needs some thought. But the suspension seemed ok. My preload on the rear had very indistinct clicks, in fact I didn't even notice them at first. I never could find these marks that are supposed to be on the adjuster. It wasn't already maxed though, as adjusting made a big difference.

I need to follow Phil's (Firefight911) suggestion and measure the sag. I do have one question: I thought the 25 to 33% sag setting were for street riding. Do dual sports typically use the same criteria? I was thinking I saw somewhere that there is a difference.... possibly in Works Performance's documentation.

Oh and Phil, can't wait to show you how much faster black is in September! ::008::

 

[Firefight911]

I do have one question: I thought the 25 to 33% sag setting were for street riding. Do dual sports typically use the same criteria? I was thinking I saw somewhere that there is a difference.... possibly in Works Performance's documentation.

Oh and Phil, can't wait to show you how much faster black is in September! ::008::

Couple schools of thought on the whole street, dual sport, dirt conundrum. One thing to consider between a traditional street machine and our adventure dual sports is that a typical street bike will have 5 to 5-1/2 inches of total travel versus 7 to 8 inches or more on an adventure dual sport. That means that, since we are dealing in percentages, the sag will still be sitting in the meat of the travel based on the 25-33% static sag starting point. Regardless, the goal is to get a suspension that provides good handling, keeps the wheels in contact with the surface they are riding upon, and to not be jarring or wallow. One other very important thing to take in to account is that a suspension should be utilizing 90-95% of its travel most of the time. Your goal is to use as much travel as possible within the above aspects of handling, contact patch, and feel without top out or bottom out. A suspension that doesn't use its range is a waste. The travel is there, use it. First thing I always do is throw a zip tie around a stanchion. Rear shock is usually visually identifiable but a tie could be placed on the shock shaft also, just make that one small and ensure it won't damage anything. Also, though there are recommended start points for any suspension. If, through objective set up first, you find that the suspension is not performing to your subjective desires start moving the adjustments to the point you gain satisfaction. Just ensure you are utilizing the full range of travel available over the terrain you are primarily riding on. The compromise comes in to play on terrain you don't have your suspension set up for. In those situations you either readjust to the terrain or ride within the limitations the suspension inherently will have until you return to your "normal" terrain.

Oh, and your black may be fast but blue is gonna take you to school! ::017:: ::017::

 

[SisuTen]

Well, it just is easier to get it done right from the start. This isn't my first rodeo.

The odds that the stock suspension won't work as well as it can when the range of riders buying the bike will be beween 130 and 300 pounds with some adding two up riding and others carrying the kitchen sink is unlikey.

It would be interesting each time someone posts about the benefits of the stock suspension over custom built for the rider aftermarket suspension if the poster started out their comments by stating how many times they have had aftermarket suspension built for their bikes.

This is a general comment not directed at anyone in particular, but until you have actually ridden a bike with top quality suspension built for you and set up for your riding style the comments questioning the merits or values of aftermarket suspension are not based on fact but rather an opinion derived from th internet.

So how much does it cost to buy top of the line aftermarket suspension for the Tenere ?

The rear Ohlins will be about 900 - 1000 and the front Traxxion kit installed will be in the range of 1200 dollars. Setup for sag etc will likely be under $200

I hope that helps.

Bill,
I'm with you regarding the stock suspension, sort of. But I suspect that it's quite adequate for about 85% of the riders. It's clear that the factory would want that to be the case. I don't necessarily believe it's "Shite".

Personally, I won't be competing on the bike and I doubt you will either. If I were, then $2500 upgrades would seem sensible, even mandatory. If I were 6'4" and 240#, I would probably have no choice but to have custom suspension built to accommodate a physical package that definitely falls outside the 85th percentile. Not my situation.

On the other hand, it would be nice to simply have the very best that's available, regardless of expense. Unfortunately, I am not shackled with those preogatives (or abundant money) in my life.

I had my bike out on the first of many long rides in the mountains today. It was like a dream. Now, I didn't just fall off the truck, and I do possess a little knowledge regarding bikes, but I'm truly amazed that so many things could go so right in a factory package right off the shelf. I went from 4900 ft elevation to over 12,000 and it ran perfectly. It had no changes to the suspension, but I could tell it could use a little tweaking. No problem. I'm 62 and after today, it's very clear what this bike was made for, and it suits me perfectly. I truthfully could not find anything that needed serious improvement. Even the dreaded "T" mode has found a spot in my heart. Who would have thought, in light of the comments on the forum.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I'm really happy that you'll be getting exactly what you want, and I'm sure others will do the same. It's all good, but few owners of this great bike will need what you need in order to enjoy it. I know I have many other things I'd rather have than an additional $2500 worth of suspension components, particularly in light of where our government is planning to take us.

That said, if I feel my riding requirements fall outside the abilities of the stock setup, I'll certainly be calling you for advice, because I have no question that you speak from solid experience and intelligence.

The book, "Sportbike Suspension Tuning by Andrew Trevitt" will enable ANYONE here to do a proper suspension setup, including a professional sag adjustment for the cost of the book. About $35 shipped. It has pictures,too!

I have no stake in the success of the book, it's just a very good book.

After my bike has 600-700 miles, I'll do the setup described in this book. I want the suspension settled in a bit first, so I don't have to do it twice in short mileage.

I'd encourage the vast majority to try this first. Then if think you need it, get the best, you really can't go wrong doing that.

I hope this helps, too.

Paul

 

[3putt]

Very good post Sisuten. +1

I have had custom suspension before and currently have a Multi 1200 which is very nice suspension right out of the box, so this is not my first rodeo either. ::013:: I am not using but 80% of my forks suspension and the rider sag is only 21%, so they are stiff for me even with preload completely off, but still a pretty nice ride.

I also do not consider the suspension shite even tho it appears I could use another spring in the forks.