Ya, really just wishful thinking. I mean, they still haven't sold all of the 2013 S10's they imported 4 years ago, so it's hard to imagine that it would be worth dividing things up into smaller chunks. I just like the idea because as a 93.675% (roughly) on-road guy, I'd like to have lighter cast wheels. That's really the only road-oriented change I could envision, as the thing is an absolute touring beast once you get the wind and seat addressed. I can't wait to take off next month and put a few thousand miles on it!kgfire said:
kgfire said:
I've wondered about this idea as well, and anyone with yamaha ownership history knows yamaha engineers could do a great job IF the concept was approved and actually moved forward. A few year back as I was mid way going back and forth between demo'ing and evaluating the Triumph 800/1200 ADV bikes, and then back to the KTM 1190 Enduro since I was riding a lot of KTMs at the time..., then I started down the path of the whole 21" vs. 19" front wheel debate inside my own head and what wheel I wanted on a large 1200cc bike, ugh. So the real question came down to how much time will I actually use this bike for offroad vs. on-road use. As it turns out, I use my S10 for 80%+ on-road use, i.e. 19" front wheel.kgfire said:
Yes, I don't think there is any overriding technical issue with hydraulic lifters in an OHC bike, at least not at the RPM ceiling that the S10 operates at. But it would add weight and cost.dietDrThunder said:
I agree it's unlikely that Yamaha will ever pursue it; but direct cam impingement shim buckets that could just as easily positioned under the rockers requiring a tiny fraction of the disassembly to do a valve adjustment (with a lot of less risk), seems a no brainer for a bike with RTW pretensions for maintenance autonomy.markjenn said:
None of us have any good data, but I doubt the GS is structurally deficient compared to the S10 or suffers poorer reliability because it is lighter.WJBertrand said:
Must just be crappy engineering then.markjenn said:
There are only a few causes for broken parts, used for the intended purpose. Wrong material, too little material, or an inherently poor engineering design. With today's CAD/CAM and FEA capabilities, I'm sure BMW has done the stress analysis on their parts when selecting cross sections and material types for their ideal intended uses. What I suspect is that they are high on the engineering efficiency of the design and do not consider uses outside of their evidently unrealistic internally established use conditions. To add a plus 20% or some other design buffer would offend their sense of efficiency and I'm sure, being German, they can't imagine someone going outside their use condition and if they do they must be nincompoops and it's therefore their fault. My Grandmother was German so I know this kind of thinking.markjenn said:
I wouldn't necessarily characterize it as "crappy".... maybe "sloppy" at times with insufficient testing and over-engineered solutions for problems that really don't need solutions. Images of broken sub-frames and swingarms, burned up final drives, and connecting rods projecting through crankcases get lots of play on the internet, but 99% of bike problems these days are electrical, sensor, instrument, software, etc. This is the stuff that the Japanese tend to be more conservative about and do more testing of. This is the reason the S10 is more reliable than a GS, not that it is structurally stronger.Andylaser said:Must just be crappy engineering then.
Considering how many threads there are on this forum from potential Tenere buyers wanting to know where they can find the cheapest new bikes on showroom floors and that there are a bunch of highly discounted new unsold '13, '14, and '15 Super Teneres out there ... it's hard to imagine Yamaha addressing all the issues brought up in this thread without an increase in the MSRP.markjenn said:
Huh. I wish I knew where! I've been on the lookout for a new-old-stock '15 ES, and the dealers I've contacted haven't offered anything resembling what I'd consider "highly discounted". In fact, most won't even discuss budging on price. The best I've seen on a new '15 ES is $13.7 (including fees), which seems a bit high to me. A few have offered at $13.2, but by the time you tack on the fees-- not so good of a deal.kgfire said:
Yep. SoCal is notorious among most CA dealers for having the lowest price "minus fees". I went through this on my former Beta, KTM, Husky, and Yamaha Tenere' thinking I could pick up a bike while I was down there visiting family. Nope, in all four cases came back empty handed with no bike. As it should be, I ended up buying the bikes at my local area NorCal dealers for an overall lower OUT THE DOOR price. But, after figuring time, travel, and fuel costs messing around, it was pretty close anyhow.kgfire said:
