Ignition Coils/Wet riding

[stutrump]

So, a bit of detail first!
Collectively (across 3 S10's) I have done over 260,000 miles. Most of this is in the pissing rain (UK).
After all these years I STILL haven't got to the bottom of why my S10(s) cough and splutter AFTER I've done a ride in VERY heavy rain.
It behaves as if it isn't firing on all cylinders. This has prompted me to change coils in the past but I'm thinking it might just be water getting in somewhere.
Any thoughts, shared experiences greatly appreciated

 

[bimota]

i have a fender extender, and a old car number plate fitted across the front makes a huge difference, i don,t park in the wet on side stand anymore as all the water runs into that left side plug, but no issues now

 

[stutrump]

Thanks Bimota.
Out of interest, BEFORE you fitted that guard, did you have similar problems to me? The coils on my latest S10 seem to remain dry but I'm suspecting that water gets into the 4 connectors on the coil/ignition leads. Hope that makes sense

 

[bimota]

i didn,t get any cough or spluttering, but my bike isn,t a work bike just pleasure but water was getting on the head, and if on side stand the
left side first coil stick and pug were bad compared to the other 3

rob

 

[stutrump]

Thanks Rob. My No.1 coil (on my previous S10, used to get rusty, which is why I removed the metal sleeves from all 4 coils.
On this S10 it doesn't appear to get rusty but something is getting wet.
Going out to the garage in a mo to have a look. Did 200 miles with it spluttering today and I have another 200 miles (for work) tmrw. Will update tmrw. Cheers

 

[lund]

We have been using this product for years now on everything from ignition, alternators, starters and switches where moisture or water is an issue, so like marine application in particular.
It has dielectric in it. We have tested alternator that we purposely submerged in water that were hooked up to a belt and electric motor. The alternator worked as normal under water.

 

[SparrowHawkxx]

So, a bit of detail first!
Collectively (across 3 S10's) I have done over 260,000 miles. Most of this is in the pissing rain (UK).
After all these years I STILL haven't got to the bottom of why my S10(s) cough and splutter AFTER I've done a ride in VERY heavy rain.
It behaves as if it isn't firing on all cylinders. This has prompted me to change coils in the past but I'm thinking it might just be water getting in somewhere.
Any thoughts, shared experiences greatly appreciated

Check out this thread:
Water in Plug Wells - Prevention, a possible solution | Yamaha Super Tenere Forum
Reply #1

• This gives you dimensions for O-Rings to put up under the skirt of the rubber boot at the top of the coils.

Reply #40

• The picture in this reply shows where to put a zip tie/cable tie at the top of the skirt. The skirt is a separate piece, so water could possibly seep in between the skirt and the coil.
• The picture also shows a smaller O-Ring between the two raised rings (pseudo O-rings) on the rubber boot

I had a very wet Alaska trip a few years ago and had a lot of engine sputtering problems, rusty plugs, etc.
After the trip, I put the larger O-rings under the skirt at the top of the coil and put small zip ties at the top of the skirt. I did not put the smaller O-ring on as discussed above.
I also put a fender extender on.

Since making these three changes I have not had any more water intrusion problems but I have not ridden through continuous rain for days either.
I added the O-rings, zip ties and the fender extender all at the same time so I can't say for sure what has helped the most but if I had to guess and just do one of these things I would try the O-rings under the skirt first.

 

[stutrump]

Thanks folks.
A quick update. I did check the coils/plugs, and all was well in there. As I mentioned, I've had this problem on previous Tenere's. This time I'm sure it's not the plugs/coils. Had a good look around, sprayed something similar to what lund recommended (thanks) on several connectors. Didn't really help..BUT...
Since posting this thread I've done another 1,000 miles and all is well again. So, I'm none the wiser but I'm happy that all seems well at the moment. Maybe there was a bit of water in the fuel.
Thanks for your help folks

 

[RCinNC]

I also had an electrical issue with the bike this past July after a full day of riding in heavy rain. The bike had about 99,000 miles on it at that point, and I'd never experienced the problem before. I have ridden in the rain lots of times, but I will have to say, that day in July was probably the worst ever since I bought the bike. A solid 10 hours or so of downpour while riding, and then it rained all night while the bike sat outside under a cover. The next morning I started it and had a flashing ECU warning on the screen, along with an ABS warning light and a TCS that shut itself off and couldn’t be turned back on. The bike ran normally, and after it warmed up for a while, the the ECU warning disappeared, the ABS light shut off, and the TCS came back on. The brakes worked normally, even with the ABS warning light on. I had it checked at the Waynesville Cycle Center and the only codes they could find were a low voltage code in the fuel injectors (which I suspect was from last year when I had a battery failure on a trip) and an 11/25 code for the front wheel sensor. That's all there was. The mechanic told me they see this sort of thing a lot in bikes after being exposed to heavy rain; that sometimes, after sitting outside in the pouring rain overnight, the horns on some of the bikes will just start beeping on their own.

I've put another 3000 miles on the bike since that happened, and there haven't been any additional issues. I've ridden in the rain since then, but nothing like that day back in July.

 

[cyclemike4]

I ride in rain all the time and the bike sits out in rain all the time. Lucky me no issues but the more electronics they put on bikes im expecting to see a lot more issues from wet riding. My cousin has a truck that runs fine till it rains on it. He has found out if he pulls just the front of the truck under a shed at night when it rains it will run fine the next morning. It has a hood on it too!

 

[eemsreno]

My wife and I was riding our Yamaha XS1100 up in Banff N.P. [1981] in heavy rain when it started running on only two cylinders. I noticed that when I shifted into neutral it would pick up the other two and run fine. When I put it into gear to take off, back to two cylinders. I removed the neutral switch wire and grounded it under a bolt head and it ran fine in the rain. I read in a cycle magazine later how to fix that problem on the XS1100. I never got around to the fix and the bike still has the neutral wire grounded to this day. [Procrastinator]
Back to the Tenere though.

 

[stutrump]

Thanks folks.
Interesting comments from you eemsreno, thanks. Every day is a school day.
It seems to rain all the time in the uk so I'm pretty sure I will get this problem again in the future and eventually I will figure out what it is!

 

[stutrump]

So...back to square one. The problem came back (after several more 6hr+ rides in the rain).
I cleaned up the airbox (there was a bit of water in there).
I removed all coils and plugs. All sparking fine. There was water in plug no.1 but I changed that plug as a precaution.
After all those checls, the bike is still mis-firing badly. On one start up, the cylinder one exhaust went red hot very quickly, so I shut the bike off but had to use the bike later for work and it didn't go red hot then, even though it was still mis-firing and running rough.
Any more ideas folks?
I'm thoroughly confused by it.

 

[MIKE R]

You mentioned earlier that you suspected water in the fuel. I once had a leaking petrol cap that caused similar problems.

Stuff some paper towel into the tank petrol opening and close the cap. Pour some water over the cap and then see if the paper towel is wet.

If it is this product could help



Hope this helps

Mike

Ps as an afterthought when did you last clean your in tank petrol filter. I toured Norway in torrential rain and got a bad misfire. I thought it was a water problem but it turned out to be my in tank petrol filter was blocked. The rain could be a coincidence sending you in the wrong direction.

 

[Tenforeplay]

For an exhaust pipe to glow it takes a lot of fuel or late combustion. I wonder if your O2 sensors are being affected by moisture and messing with your fueling, or something connected with them. But after the first pipe glowing you said it didn't do it again, so the heat maybe dried them out.

 

[bimota]

Glowing exhaust header

Early morning, bike starts just fine, goes fine after that...but while warming up, one of the pipes seems to get a bit hotter than the other. I never noticed this until winter for the obvious reason...the lack of light makes it noticeable....Don't know it it's "normal" or a sign than one of the...

yamahasupertenere.com

 

[RCinNC]

A red hot exhaust pipe leads me towards thinking that the OP has either a lean running condition, or else an exhaust valve is not completely closing and burning fuel is being pushed into the exhaust. Loss of compression from a partially open exhaust valve could account for that feeling that the bike wasn't firing on all cylinders.

I can't explain why this might be tied to riding in wet conditions, but it's also possible that you're dealing with one or more unrelated issues. First thing I'd do is pull the plugs and see what they look like. If the plugs look greyish white, then you're dealing with a lean fuel mix. A compression test will tell you if you have an actual leak in one of the valves, and I'd probably be considering doing a valve clearance check too if one hasn't been done recently.

Or you could take it to a shop and just have them put it on a scanner and see what sort of error codes have been logged that might account for this persistent condition. Sometimes, that scanner can save you a lot of time spent on the "change this component and see what happens" type response.

 

[Tenforeplay]

Or, say you are going down the road in a rain storm and the water hitting the headers supercools them and the contraction causes the joint between the head and pipe to open and let in air, causing the O2 sensor to read a lean condition wherein it then adds fuel. With all the clatter and clanging from the engine it'd be hard to hear an exhaust leak being it is on the front down low.

Could be a lot of things. Just takes a little imagination

Has the fueling been adjusted via the ecu?

 

[stutrump]

Thanks folks. I really appreciate all your replies.
I will certainly try the paper towel trick to see if my petrol cap is leaking.
I took the coils out again tonight to check.
Each coil was reading 1.5 primary and 9.5 secondary, which I believe suggests they are all fine.
I did a valve check and adjust about 6,000 miles (3 months ago) and it has been running beautifully since then (until this problem). I changed the filter in the fuel pump about 3,000 miles ago and it ran fine after that.
I also cleaned inside the kill switch tonight but it was clean and dry anyway.
Really confused.
I did have a similar issue on my previous Tenere when it had about 150,000 miles on it but it came and went so I never really got to the real cause then either.
On this bike though it feels worse. It's very uncomfortable to ride now because it coughs and splutters really bad.
I'll try some other things asap and will see if I can get it plugged into a diagnostic tool.
I'll update if I can ever sort it out!
Thanks again folks

 

[cyclemike4]

Thanks folks. I really appreciate all your replies.
I will certainly try the paper towel trick to see if my petrol cap is leaking.
I took the coils out again tonight to check.
Each coil was reading 1.5 primary and 9.5 secondary, which I believe suggests they are all fine.
I did a valve check and adjust about 6,000 miles (3 months ago) and it has been running beautifully since then (until this problem). I changed the filter in the fuel pump about 3,000 miles ago and it ran fine after that.
I also cleaned inside the kill switch tonight but it was clean and dry anyway.
Really confused.
I did have a similar issue on my previous Tenere when it had about 150,000 miles on it but it came and went so I never really got to the real cause then either.
On this bike though it feels worse. It's very uncomfortable to ride now because it coughs and splutters really bad.
I'll try some other things asap and will see if I can get it plugged into a diagnostic tool.
I'll update if I can ever sort it out!
Thanks again folks

It looks like you are checking everything. that is what you have to do. I have heard of the key switch having a certain contact not making good causing issues in this bike. One set of contacts keeps things powered up but another one would shut it down if it opened and the dash was staying on. I can't see three bikes having the same issue but you never know if all three had the same things making them miss. Just a thought. I do know my buddy had this very problem with his Harley key switch.