How to Replace Your Rear Spokes.

[protondecay123]

Not that this is really rocket science since I was able to do it, but just a few FYI's that may be helpful.

Yamaha will only sell you the entire set. You can't buy only three or 4 of them from Yamaha. The package will look something like this below.

There are two different types of spokes. One that mount on the "Inner" tab and one that mounts on the "Outer tab". The spokes that mount on the "Outer" tab are about 1/4" longer than the others .

Here's a picture of the tabs.

Putting the spokes and the 5 mm hex nut in their proper place is common sensical. The nuts seem all them same.

The nut in the tab.

Use a extra long 5 mm hex key socket to tighten them. Believe me, The L keys, T handles etc were cumbersome when you get close to the disc brakes. This works best IMHO >>> YMMV

I'm not going to blame Mama Yama just yet. This was my fault. I should have paid more attention to the maintenance schedule and checked them earlier.

 

[pluric]

Don't feel bad. I had the same $100 spoke lesson too. :-[

 

[HoebSTer]

Proton,
Since you were replacing them, why didn't you go with Woody's Stainless Spokes in Denver? He even uses longer nipples (Like Farrah's)

 

[coastie]

Yea the manual shows to use the hex key socket also. I would not want to do that job with the "L" or "T" handles.

 

[3putt]

Thanks for posting.

 

[colorider]

Proton,
Since you were replacing them, why didn't you go with Woody's Stainless Spokes in Denver? He even uses longer nipples (Like Farrah's)

SST spokes should eliminate the concern of having to replace them a second (or more) time!

 

[protondecay123]

SST spokes should eliminate the concern of having to replace them a second (or more) time!

Considering that there are 31 more spokes to go (and the fact that if I had done my due diligence replacement wouldn't have been necessary) that might just wait awhile before start something like that.

 

[trikepilot]

I searched the forum here and found many threads on how to keep spokes clean, but I wanted more info on how to replace the spokes - sort of.

I found 3-4 loose spokes on my rear on Saturday and I tightened them up. I made a small turn and tapped them to see if they had a tone similar to others. If not, I tightened a tad more and rechecked. Repeat till tone is same. This was not scientific but it "fixed" the problem at the time. Now I am looking for a more permanent solution and thus my search of the forum here.

This spawns three questions:

1) I found no reference to a specific torque setting for the spokes - might be buried on the forum somewhere, but does anybody have one handy?
2) Or do we simply go by tone when we tap on the spoke
3) And can I assume that replacing one at time is the way to go?

What I want to do is to take each nipple off the spoke, place some locktite in the threads, and then re-install. I want to do this all the way around the wheel on both sides to help prevent further loosening. However, I want to make sure that I also keep the wheel "true" in the process. So I am thinking that if I only take one spoke apart at a time and then resnug before moving on - that I am vastly reducing the chance of getting the wheel out of line.

Anybody done this process before and can shed any light on the process? And yes... I will also be ziptying the spokes together when done.

Thanks!!

 

[S_Palmer]

Locktie 290 will penetrate the threads and secure them without removing the nut.
Will save you a lot of work.

 

[Ironhand]

Take this for whay it's worth, but those loose spokes are not the result of the nipples loosening. They are "seating" into the softer wheel and hub and to a lesser extent stretching a bit. Eventually, they will bed in and require little to no attention. Thread locker is just going to make future maintenance harder.

 

[offcamber]

Conversely if you check the torque on the spokes, make sure you set the torque wrench right or your going to have a wonky wheel....ask me how I know :. Cost me $60 at the local shopt o have it trued up. Worth it to me because I would have mucked it up worse for sure.

 

[markjenn]

This spawns three questions:

1) I found no reference to a specific torque setting for the spokes - might be buried on the forum somewhere, but does anybody have one handy?
2) Or do we simply go by tone when we tap on the spoke
3) And can I assume that replacing one at time is the way to go?

The book torque setting is 4.3 ft-lb. But adjusting all the spokes to the same torque usually pulls the rim out of true as a true rim may have spoke tensions that vary +/- 20%. And because of variances in nipple/spoke threads and how the nipple seats in the hub, contamination, etc. spoke torque is a lousy surrogate for spoke tension which just introduces more error. If the wheel is true and the spokes have more/less equal tones, you're good to go. I'd use the torque setting only as a good starting point when replacing a spoke. Having the rim true trumps equal spoke tension and torque.

Theoretically, you should be able to replace each spoke one at a time and provided you brought each spoke back to exactly the same tension it was before, the rim would still be true. But I bet in practice if you went through the entire wheel this way, variances would creep in and you'd end up with a seriously warped wheel that would need to be trued afterwards. If you feel you need loctite, I'd just use one of the thin formulations that is designed to seep into in-situ threads.

BTW, I'm not a believer loctite is a good idea to start with. First, I don't think properly tensioned spokes initially loose tension due to the nipples turning - they loose tension because the wheel gets whacked out of true. Once they've lost initial tension, loctite may keep the nipples from turning further, but if you check your wheel properly tensioned to begin with, it's not necessary and it makes any subsequent tightening/truing more difficult. (The mechanics of a spoke nipple turning in its hub seat against normal spoke tension just don't make sense to me.) FWIIW, I've put witness paint on all my un-loctited spoke nipples front/rear and none have moved one iota in 22K miles, except of course, those which I've manually tweaked using the sound method. (I check rim trueness when I balance tires after tire changes - it's not absolutely perfect, but its close enough I don't feel I need to do attempt a re-truing.)

Somewhat controversial subject, but that's my take. Don't fix what isn't broken. And I think the tremendous variation in folks' experiences is mostly just dramatically different riding conditions and loads - these are big/heavy bikes and I see people carrying ridiculous loads and whacking them across terrain at speeds that I would consider suicidal. To me, this is operating the bike outside its design envelope.

- Mark

 

[OldRider]

And OldRider sells the spokes 4/$12 so there's no need to get the $100 lesson.

 

[trikepilot]

Thanks guys. Will reassess the locktite idea. Still want to do something to help resist the loosening of spokes in the future and controlling the where and how I ride is not very high on the list unfortunately. I have ambitious plans for the big girl and want to make sure I figure out some way to minimize spoke issues sooner rather than later.

No spokes are currently missing but thanks to you, OldRider, I already have some spares on hand!!

 

[markjenn]

Thanks guys. Will reassess the locktite idea. Still want to do something to help resist the loosening of spokes in the future and controlling the where and how I ride is not very high on the list unfortunately. I have ambitious plans for the big girl and want to make sure I figure out some way to minimize spoke issues sooner rather than later.

Just check them, the harder you beat the bike, the more often. And slow down 5 mph in the rocks. 650-lb bikes (typical) with 6" of suspension travel have no business pounding through rock fields. Nor jumping.

- Mark

 

[snakebitten]

Nor jumping?

Party pooper.

 

[trikepilot]

It's not me!! I promise!

Were I in control, I'd be at Starbucks or maybe cruising the Blue Ridge Parkway at the speed limit or hanging at the local BMW dealership.

But it's this damn bike. She asks - no... she flat-out demands! - that I treat her like the world's largest dirtbike. Who am I to argue?

So meanwhile, I'll keep a close eye on the spokes.

 

[snakebitten]

I wouldn't fret too much.
It's true they need to be watched very closely for the first few thousand miles. Especially if you are flogging her off road. (absolutely appropriate, I might add)
But once they "settle", you find they rarely need much adjustment.
I have my rear spokes wired together, just in case. But I have yet to loose one at 36,500. And I never find one loose these days either.
But I act like I could.

 

[trikepilot]

Fancy has nearly 14k on it so these spokes should be "settled in" by now. I check fairly regularly and these on Sat were the first loose ones I have had yet.

Carry on...

 

[snakebitten]

Then you ARE having fun on the Beast. That's an indicator. Ha!