The Gift of Global Warming—December Riding

Jlq1969

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 5, 2018
Messages
1,812
Location
Argentina
Livestock Farming is on course to gobble up Half the Worlds Carbon Budget.
We should not blame cows for global warming….they are a consequence….not the cause…..if you look at these two graphs (comparing the rate of population growth vs. the rate of increase in the average temperature of the planet)… ..you will find a similarity in the graph
EB1CFA93-ADE7-4A37-AAD9-44C21FA51E66.pngB2035E65-5959-474C-B2A4-89032501A518.gif
 

fac191

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2016
Messages
2,852
Location
London
We should not blame cows for global warming….they are a consequence….not the cause…..if you look at these two graphs (comparing the rate of population growth vs. the rate of increase in the average temperature of the planet)… ..you will find a similarity in the graph
View attachment 96772View attachment 96773
Of course that is common sense.
And people are living longer.
And its not the Cows fault. If you gave them a choice they would prefer to live naturally. Ironically all these things are really not going to impact what life i have left. I care for the people affected. Its called Empathy. And ultimately we can rely on Nature to control things. Its wether we can live with the results.
 

Quique

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2021
Messages
205
Location
Guadalajara Spain
We should not blame cows for global warming….they are a consequence….not the cause…..if you look at these two graphs (comparing the rate of population growth vs. the rate of increase in the average temperature of the planet)… ..you will find a similarity in the graph
So reducing the population to the 1800 level is the solution. Might be a solution, but not an acceptable one.
Do you have anything to do with the meat industry? If so, reducing the population is not a solution to you either.
 

Sierra1

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2016
Messages
15,090
Location
Joshua TX
Ok, so what caused the last 4 global warmings if we weren't there? We've had 5 ice ages. Warmed up every time after one. I mean, something melted the glaciers covering the US. I'm not saying we shouldn't clean up our act, but whether we do or not . . . . global warming will continue. To what point, I don't know. 'Cuz, very likely, there's another ice age in the Earth's future. I say Earth's future since man's future is not guaranteed.
 

fac191

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2016
Messages
2,852
Location
London
If we get to know how events occur naturally and study the after effects we can build models to simulate different events. We do that with Viruses its called Gain of Function. We understand how plants soak up elements. So if through our activities we are adding to natures normal events we can model our effect on it. We have alot of data from pre industrial times to now. Deforestation, burning fossil fuels ect. The data is there its about having reliable models which can translate it. Computers have been a major leap for us to run and create models. Just look at engines too lean and they run too hot and cause damage. Too rich and it fouls the plugs and leaves carbon on the valves and pistons ect. Subtle changes in Earths Orbit can play a part in Ice Ages as can volcanic activity. Once you can rule out enough natural occurances it leaves us.
 

Quique

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2021
Messages
205
Location
Guadalajara Spain
so what caused the last 4 global warmings if we weren't there?
fac has given some explanations, I will add one, the movement of the tectonic plates. The place where I am now was under the sea millions of years ago. If a given area moves to the north or the south, the climate in that area will change. The ocean currents changed too. It is clear that they were caused by natural events not related to human activities.
As it is also clear that this climate change is caused by human activities. It started in the industrial revolution and has continued until today. The biologists know it well since time ago and have been warning the humankind with no results. I studied it in the university in the eighties, forty years ago. We can prove it. We know how the greenhouse gases work. So yes, if we change, if we take action, we can stop this climate change. Not completely, a change of +1,5ºC is unavoidable. We could had avoided it if we had taken action before. But we can prevent that the warming would be even bigger. Some models predict a change of +10ºC and that is catastrophic.
 

fac191

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2016
Messages
2,852
Location
London
Thanks for adding that. Tectonic Plate movement creates mountains which in turn creates snow as well. Natural events. I think it was in the 70's a report was commissioned by i believe the US President at the time to look into the effects of Fossil Fuels. It was surpressed but came out a long time after. Their predictions were pretty spot on to what we are seeing now. Forgive me for the vague but its all out there.
 
Last edited:

Quique

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2021
Messages
205
Location
Guadalajara Spain
Nothing to forgive, fac. We complement each other. I am learning a lot here. For example, vague is a new word to me. English is my second language and I do my best. What I cannot always follow is your British sense of humour. Carry on with it, it's fantastic, I like it a lot, but I cannot always follow and I am always amazed. Perhaps the sense of humour is the more local of all things.
 

Quique

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2021
Messages
205
Location
Guadalajara Spain
Diesel generators o_O
If a certain society can afford electric vehicles of any type they can afford a much cleaner form of energy generation. Deisel generators, what a copout.
Oh yes. Electricity generation in Spain. 2021
Eolic 23% Nuclear 20.6% Combined cycle 17.6% Hydraulic 11.3% Cogeneration 10% Photovoltaic 8.1% Coal 1.9%
Spain is not the richest country in the planet. We are working to increase renewables and reduce coal, gas and nuclear.
The same in Argentina. 2020
Thermal (mainly gas, also coal and diesel) 61.3% Hydraulic 27% Eolic and solar 7.3% Nuclear 4.4%
They have gas so they burn it with no remorse
 

Sierra1

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2016
Messages
15,090
Location
Joshua TX
. . . . As it is also clear that this climate change is caused by human activities. It started in the industrial revolution and has continued until today. The biologists know it well since time ago and have been warning the humankind with no results. I studied it in the university in the eighties, forty years ago. We can prove it. We know how the greenhouse gases work. So yes, if we change, if we take action, we can stop this climate change. Not completely, a change of +1,5ºC is unavoidable. We could had avoided it if we had taken action before. But we can prevent that the warming would be even bigger. Some models predict a change of +10ºC and that is catastrophic.
Once again, I did not express my point very well. I will not argue that man has negatively influenced global warming. But if modern man wasn't present, as in the last four global warmings, our planet would continue to warm. It is the planet's natural cycle to warm and cool. Regardless of what man is doing or not doing.

To me volcanos are proof of that. Heat builds up below ground, and has to go somewhere. And talk about greenhouse gasses. Not only greenhouse gasses, but straight up poisonous. There are pockets of methane in the Siberian tundra that are venting tons of gases into the air. No humans involved.

The Industial Revolution was a mere 500 years ago. We've been Earth has been experiencing ice ages, and periods of warmth, for millions of years.

I personally believe that the only reason we are worrying about global warming is that certain people have found a way to use it to make their fortune. It's like a snowball goin' down a hill. Starts out small and keeps getting bigger. Like those people pouring out milk to protest cows. And the lady slashing SUV tires protesting gas guzzlers.

The Earth is just doing what it's been doing for millions of years. And will continue to do so with or without man.
 

Jlq1969

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 5, 2018
Messages
1,812
Location
Argentina
Oh yes. Electricity generation in Spain. 2021
Eolic 23% Nuclear 20.6% Combined cycle 17.6% Hydraulic 11.3% Cogeneration 10% Photovoltaic 8.1% Coal 1.9%
Spain is not the richest country in the planet. We are working to increase renewables and reduce coal, gas and nuclear.
The same in Argentina. 2020
Thermal (mainly gas, also coal and diesel) 61.3% Hydraulic 27% Eolic and solar 7.3% Nuclear 4.4%
They have gas so they burn it with no remorse
it seems to me that the information on electrical energy in Spain is not completely complete….On the one hand there is the generation (which must be in the percentages that you say)….on the other hand there is the total energy consumption in the country…..from what I see, all the energy generated “inside” the country….represents 30% of consumption…..the other 70% of the energy consumed is purchased from neighboring countries…..
 

fac191

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2016
Messages
2,852
Location
London
I think the blame game will not get us anywhere. Any Country or State who had Oil or Gas will have exploited it, its Human Nature to do so. The World needed Oil and Gas so we were given it and we happily took it. Its Normal for us. Its also Normal for us to overfish the Oceans, we like fish. We also like to dump old fishing nets in the Oceans. Fish dont like it but they dont vote. We like money but we want more so we create it unnaturally. Only 10% of money is in Hard Currency the rest exists on Computers its not real. There is a Theme here.
 

lund

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2019
Messages
811
Location
Okanagan Valley, Canada.
Its "f'n" cold here for November, so today it's more global cooling in my neck of the woods.
10" of snow at my house and -18deg.C, Hate to see what January and February will bring, our coldest months. YIKES
 

fac191

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2016
Messages
2,852
Location
London
15c in London. Someone must have left the windows open in Westminster. That is a Health and Safety Issue. What if they fell out, they are falling out alot at the moment.
 
Top