Replacing the shaft drive oil seals

[erenet]

Soon I'll be changing a oil seal, I haven't taken it apart yet, but I'm suspecting that the oil is leaking from the front of the pumpkin page 4-106 #13.
To remove the old seal I need a special tool, it can be seen on page 4-112 of the (pdf) service manual, I'll need to stop the coupling gear (#11) from spinning, when removing the nut that's holding it so I can get to the seal.

Any of you know where I can get this special tool? 'Coupling gear holding tool 90890-01560'

 

[scott123007]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

It's called an air wrench. All "holder" special tools become obsolete when you air impact stuff off.

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

Thanks Scott, I didn't think of that and it should work to get it out, but I'd feel better using a torque wrench to put it together, for that I would need the tool.

 

[Dallara]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

Soon I'll be changing a oil seal, I haven't taken it apart yet, but I'm suspecting that the oil is leaking from the front of the pumpkin page 4-106 #13.
To remove the old seal I need a special tool, it can be seen on page 4-112 of the (pdf) service manual, I'll need to stop the coupling gear (#11) from spinning, when removing the nut that's holding it so I can get to the seal.

Any of you know where I can get this special tool? 'Coupling gear holding tool 90890-01560'

Your Yamaha dealer should be able to order it for you. Special tools are usually right there in their parts catalogs like any other part numbered piece. My bet is that it will be very pricey, though, as dealer special tools almost always are.

Dallara



~

 

[Duconce]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

If the pumpkin is the same as the FJR, isn't the seal in front of the nut, part of the drive shaft assembly?

 

[dcstrom]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

I meant to ask - did Yamaha say why they denied the warranty claim?

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

Thanks Dallara, I was hoping for a different place to buy the tool, the dealer might be the only place to get it.
I don't know why all this is happening at about 22000km, I did 95% on road 5% or less on gravel roads .

I meant to ask - did Yamaha say why they denied the warranty claim?

The warranty is just over for my bike, I guess I should be happy that Y Canada and the Y dealer have confirmed that they'll replace the rear shock "because it's defected", not the oil seal/seals, it started leaking one week after I found out I couldn't adjust the rear shock.

If the pumpkin is the same as the FJR, isn't the seal in front of the nut, part of the drive shaft assembly?

I've been thinking about that too, if I understand this correctly, the inside seal is supposed to leak some oil into the coupling gear, to lube the shaft and coupling splines. So it maybe that the seal (#39 on the diagram below) in front of the nut, part of the drive shaft assembly is the one to completely seal the oil, and may be the only one in need of replacement. I suppose the oil leak could also be outside the coupling gear.

There was another shaft drive oil leak report, apparently, the oil seal that is part of the drive shaft is the one that was pinched during original assembly. http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?topic=4652.30 The seal you're referring to is on 3Th page post 6 #39 on this diagram.

This is my first shaft drive, have you perform this repair on a FJR?

 

[Duconce]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

I think the seal you want to replace is #29, the spline on the shaft is oil lubricated from the housing.

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal


I found this FJR report, It wasn't the seal they thought it would be http://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php?showtopic=23238&hl=splooge

Another FJR report, apparently they just cleaned the outside seal in front of the nut, part of the drive shaft assembly, and lubed it. http://www.fjr-tips.org/maint/spline/SkooterG/coupling101.html

I don't have the bike with me now, it's at the dealer for two weeks today for the rear shock. I'm using this time to figure out what is the best way to do this. I'm going there now (closed yesterday) to find out how much they want for the tool. I think it would be better to just replace both seal#14 and seal#39, O-ring#13, nut#17, circlip#41 and circlip#42, as they show in the diagram above.
'These numbers are different in the service manual'.

The only good thing about this is that it's snowing outside, how long would a Y dealer need to keep a bike in the summer time? 1 month 2 months?

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

I think the seal you want to replace is #29, the spline on the shaft is oil lubricated from the housing.

You mean #39? better exposure of the diagram in this link http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?topic=4652.30

 

[dcstrom]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

I don't have the bike with me now, it's at the dealer for two weeks today for the rear shock.

...

The only good thing about this is that it's snowing outside, how long would a Y dealer need to keep a bike in the summer time? 1 month 2 months?

To change the rear shock? For a dealer, should take about 15 mins. For a home mechanic doing it for the first time, maybe an hour, going slow.

Weird aobout the shock. Mine lost all damping, but didn't leak. Replaced under extended warranty.

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

To change the rear shock? For a dealer, should take about 15 mins. For a home mechanic doing it for the first time, maybe an hour, going slow.

Weird about the shock. Mine lost all damping, but didn't leak. Replaced under extended warranty.

They told me to bring it it in January the 8Th, I think the delay is because of the miscommunication between them and Y. Canada. There was a lightly used one for sale on this forum and I should have bought it. ::010:: One thing stopped me, it said "to CONUS only".
I've also though of getting a aftermarket rear shock, but if this suspension doesn't work for me I don't think it'll work for anyone else. WTF!! they made a tall bike, I don't think they were aiming at a 100 pound 45kg man.

My shock has the preload all the way soft, and that's all I have. The knob is not striped.

 

[Duconce]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

You mean #39? better exposure of the diagram in this link http://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?topic=4652.30

Yes, I meant 39, since that was the problem in that article and it is the easiest to change I would start there and see if that fixes it

 

[HoebSTer]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

The only good thing about this is that it's snowing outside, how long would a Y dealer need to keep a bike in the summer time? 1 month 2 months?

I think common practice is for X dealer to look at the leak while bike is there figure which seal they need to order, park the bike in their storage area and wait for the part to come in. This is why it takes several days or weeks to come in. then you throw in the parts department, when it may take an extra day to order part after mechanic says to order. Then the shipping and receiving guy may take an extra day to check in his stock order and if your seal is on the bottom of the box, well than that takes longer. Once it is checked in, well it may take some time for him to either tell the shop, or just wait till customer calls and complains of where in the hell is my bike. SO the service writer walks to the parts department and asks where the part is. Oh, it is here on the shelf from the order we received the other day.

A scenario like this seems sort of common which could happen to some, not all dealers.

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

I was at the dealer a couple days ago, they told me that my rear shock was out of my bike and was ready to go to yamaha. I looked through a little window on the door, and I could see my bike at the distance on it's side kickstand, is it possible for a bike to be on a kickstand without a rear shock?
Unlike what they told me in the beginning Y. Canada is not covering the oil leak repair, so they offered to do it for approximately 2 hours of labor. I told them that I would repair the oil leak myself.
I think they have it good here in Canada with warranties on bikes. When they tell us that we have 1 year of warranty, we really get only 6 months, that's how much most of us ride per year.

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

Yes, I meant 39, since that was the problem in that article and it is the easiest to change I would start there and see if that fixes it

Thanks Duconce, that seal will probably be the only one I'll replace for now, and see how it goes. I've ordered both seals, O-ring, new nut, and new circlips, NEW, NEW, NEW, just like the service manual says . I'll need the special tool (my dealer still looking for one that I could buy) for the inner seal and O-ring. Hopefully I'll find a bike shop that has the tool and will want to do it for me, after I remove the pumpkin from the bike, that is if I can't find a tool myself.

I've done some searching and found one in a Brazilian site that has the measurements, I would measure the coupling gear first to confirm before asking someone to make me one. http://silmarferramentas.com.br/catalogo/produtos_descricao.asp?codigo_produto=501209
Translation >>" Used to fix the internal gear transmission coupling assembly and disassembly of the set. - Built in SAE 1045 steel - Diameter lower teeth 40.5mm - 46.5mm diameter greater teeth - number of teeth 29 - Rusty Black Finish - High Resistance Yamaha Application: XT1200Z Super Ténéré (Tenere) 1200 (2011)Yamaha Code: 90890-01560"
The part number (code) is the same as the sevice manual.

I also found these nice tools in a forum that were used on a FJR, nice and compact to have in the bike's tool kit, coupling gear holding tool and the bearing retainer wrench in two different views.
http://s146.beta.photobucket.com/user/gearman22/media/FJR/fjrtools.jpg.html#/user/gearman22/media/FJR/fjrtools.jpg.html?&_suid=135925208284206566298960657544

This isn't my idea, but din't we have a member who would make you a free part if you gave him a new idea? ::017::

Edited: FJR tool I'm counting 25 teeth, the first one ( Super Tenere) says 29 teeth!!

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

I'm not a mechanic by trade, take it for what it's worth.

Special tools for the Tenere are not to be found. I was told by Yamaha Canada that K&L in Santa Clara, California makes special tools for Yamaha. I've call them, they don't recognise the part numbers I gave them from the service manual. They told me they would look into it and call me back. They never return my call, I hope they'll make some for this bike.

Yesterday I made a coupling gear holding tool, it doesn't look pretty but did the job. I got the nut out and put the new one in using the tool and torque wrench.
Let me tell you, those seal looked like they were welded in there, and it's hard to put the new ones in with out the proper tools. The seal have metal inside and I bent one slightly. I'm ordering one more seal, and make some more tools, these will be used to push the seals in the proper way.

These are just pieces of pipe but need to me machined to the right measurements. Toll #1 is a double tool, I'll use both sides of it to install the outer seal, tool #2 is to push the inner seal, and this was the one leaking.

If it will leak oil in the future, it'll most likely be the inner seal again. The outer seal was dry/no leak there, unlike the inner seal, the outer seal on the shaft spins with the gear coupling. I don't think it can be re-lubed as some have suggested without replacing the seal, the coupling has a little groove in it to seal and prevent the seal from coming out , the sharp groove cut (like a little O ring) the seal when I puled it out.

 

[BWC]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

erenet, Seems your breaking a bit of new ground here. Very creative on the coupling gear holder. I did notice when I had the final drive off of mine during the swing arm service that it also had a small amount of surface rust in the area of the coupling gear and seal. Alaska road conditions and the calcium chloride dust control they use seems to get to everything. Have you been able to determine the cause of the inner seal failure?
Being a new model it would be interesting to know how many dealers have these specific service tools available for the Tenere if the need arises. And possibly a Yamaha policy to supply the tools to dealers only. Bernie

 

[HoebSTer]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

It may just be me, but when I get to this point as you have in the pics, I will carry the pumpkin into the dealer and have them change the seals. Other than that, I am doing most of the labor at home.
What are the thoughts of buying a few of these tools from Yamaha and doing an exchange program here while accepting donations until the unit is paid off, then above that goes to the forum?

 

[erenet]

Re: Changing a shaft drive oil seal

erenet, Seems your breaking a bit of new ground here. Very creative on the coupling gear holder. I did notice when I had the final drive off of mine during the swing arm service that it also had a small amount of surface rust in the area of the coupling gear and seal. Alaska road conditions and the calcium chloride dust control they use seems to get to everything. Have you been able to determine the cause of the inner seal failure?
Being a new model it would be interesting to know how many dealers have these specific service tools available for the Tenere if the need arises. And possibly a Yamaha policy to supply the tools to dealers only. Bernie

I'll post another picture of the tool, I removed all the surface rust and put some lithium grease on those parts. I tried to remove the seals carefully, to my naked eye they looked good. I want to check the runout and see if the gear coupling is true. I've talked to a private bike mechanic and a owner of a Yamaha dealer, both told me that a impact gun would be a toll they would use . It's winter here and I was in no hurry to use a impact gun.