Pinging/ Detonating

[Darren70]

Hello all! New guy here. I just purchased a '19 ES model with 15k kms on it,from a little old lady that only rode it to church on Sundays. I spent the weekend changing fluids and checking things over. I found a couple possible issues that I'd like to run by you guys. One that I think I've corrected is the rear brake caliper hanging up. I could feel a little resistance at a stop, and the brake rotor was hot. I pulled the caliper, cycled the piston back and forth a few times and cleaned/lubed the slider pins. Seems to be ok now. The other issue is while accelerating, the motor seems to ping/detonate between 2800-3200 rpm under moderate to heavy throttle. I understand these motors are known to be ticky, but I'm 90 percent sure this is pinging. Other than that the bike runs, idles and pulls like a 1200 should. I am running premium and even tried a little Lucas octane boost with no percievable change. Does anyone else's T12 do this? Thanks D.

 

[pilleway]

From Mexico welcome to the forum.
For sure you might get great recomendations and suggestions from the team!!
Regards

 

[Sierra1]

Welcome from Texas. I'm wondering if it has been sitting for a while. Sticky brake could be a symptom of that; does seem unusual considering the age/mileage though. But, if it has been sitting, and the gas is stale, it may be best to drain and refill the tank. 'Cuz, yes, the motor is not a quiet one. Agricultural has been used to describe it more than once. But, not pinging. The only time mine has done that, was in middle of one of our summers, regular grade fuel, two of us on the bike, stop-n-go traffic, and the fan had been on for awhile.

If you could, add your location to your avatar picture. Sometimes a person's location can help ascertain a problem.

 

[Darren70]

Welcome from Texas. I'm wondering if it has been sitting for a while. Sticky brake could be a symptom of that; does seem unusual considering the age/mileage though. But, if it has been sitting, and the gas is stale, it may be best to drain and refill the tank. 'Cuz, yes, the motor is not a quiet one. Agricultural has been used to describe it more than once. But, not pinging. The only time mine has done that, was in middle of one of our summers, regular grade fuel, two of us on the bike, stop-n-go traffic, and the fan had been on for awhile.

If you could, add your location to your avatar picture. Sometimes a person's location can help ascertain a problem.

Thank you for the feedback! I'm in British Columbia. Admittedly I don't have a lot of time on this bike and it's possible that it's just mechanical noise, but it sure sounds like pinging. I'll get some more time and fuel in it and see how it goes. I'm very impressed with it so far and looking through this forum it sounds like they're a great bike. Thanks!

 

[Jlq1969]

Welcome. The detonations are usually related to either bad fuel ... or ignition problems. Although 15k kilometers is little, but since you bought it used, you should check that the spark plugs are the indicated ones (cpr8ea9) ... maybe the previous owner changed them for some iridium or platinum and the ones that he put do not correspond to the thermal degree ...

 

[gunslinger_006]

If its just popping and exhaust detonation that is normal until you disable the ais via flash.

If you are pinging on decel...is your bike stock? Been flashed? Power commander?


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[Darren70]

Welcome. The detonations are usually related to either bad fuel ... or ignition problems. Although 15k kilometers is little, but since you bought it used, you should check that the spark plugs are the indicated ones (cpr8ea9) ... maybe the previous owner changed them for some iridium or platinum and the ones that he put do not correspond to the thermal degree ...

Thanks. It might be worth having a peak at the plugs. I do have the maintainance records for the bike and the plugs were changed at 11k with cpr8eb9. I know detonation can also be caused by carbon buildup in the cylinder head, causing hot spots and/or high compresson, as well as the ignition timing being advanced too far. I'm not sure if the ignition advance curve is adjusted by the ECM or if it set statically on the T12. I have read that the motor doesn't have any knock sensors, so I'm guessing it's the latter. This weekend I'll have a look at the plugs, drain the fuel tank and fill it with fresh premium and see where that goes. Thanks for the advice guys. I'm still not 100 percent sure I Do have an issue. I've read elsewhere that these engines sound like a half full tool box tumbling down the stairs.

 

[Sierra1]

. . . . I've read elsewhere that these engines sound like a half full tool box tumbling down the stairs.

Yeah!! Ain't she cool?!

 

[Jlq1969]

 

[Darren70]

If its just popping and exhaust detonation that is normal until you disable the ais via flash.

If you are pinging on decel...is your bike stock? Been flashed? Power commander?


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Thanks Gunslinger. It's not popping on decel like it's a little lean on fuel. It's definitely a detonating/pre ignition sound. I'm an old muscle car guy and know the sound well ( like marbles in a glass jar). Causes I'm aware of are fuel with insufficient octane, carbon buildup in combustion chamber, too much ignition timing, compression too high and overheating. Considering the mileage on the bike, the only cause I can surmise is too much timing. I'll put some more miles on it this weekend and IF it really is pinging, I'll look into it further. I was just wondering if this is a common T12 trait. It's not really that severe, just a little concerning. Thanks for your help !

 

[Darren70]

View attachment 74456

Hahha ! Don't think I haven't thought of that with an exhaust.

 

[Sierra1]

Music. Gotta have music when I ride now. It inspires me. . . . or at least my right wrist.

 

[Don in Lodi]

Is this free reving or under load? Free rev it's normal clatter, under load, I don't hear my engine at those corresponding speeds.

 

[Darren70]

Is this free reving or under load? Free rev it's normal clatter, under load, I don't hear my engine at those corresponding speeds.

Thanks Don. It's only under load with moderate to heavy throttle. Under light throttle/load, it's quiet. Stock motor with no tuning.

 

[WJBertrand]

I was just wondering if this is a common T12 trait.

Not common, I think this is the first post complaining of pinging/knocking that I've seem since I joined this forum back in '15. Another thought is to check for intake system air leaks, synch port covers, throttle body boots, etc.. I've actually lugged mine pretty bad unintentionally a couple times and even in really hot weather have not heard any pinging.

The bike does make kind of a mechanical hammering noise under load but this is a lower frequency sound than pinging/knocking. I've nick named my bike "Hammer".

 

[scott123007]

It's possible that if the PO rode it around like a Girl Scout it has excessive carbon build up which, as you know, both raises the compression and can cause pre-ignition. The higher the gear and the lower the revs, under load, will exacerbate the problem.

 

[Darren70]

It's possible that if the PO rode it around like a Girl Scout it has excessive carbon build up which, as you know, both raises the compression and can cause pre-ignition. The higher the gear and the lower the revs, under load, will exacerbate the problem.

Thanks guys. I'll fill it up with some good quality premium and give her nipples a good twist this weekend .

 

[SmokinRZ]

I was going to post the same question. My bike set up for 4 months for maintenance and I finally got the parts in and got it back together last week. I took it out for spin trying to burn the old gas in the tank when I noticed what sounded like a bad spark knock at 3/4 throttle under load. I was worried I got the timing off during the valve adjust. I filled up with fresh 93 octane and no more knock. I've owned a lot of bikes over the years and never had a street bike spark knock like that. I was wondering if this bike was sensitive to that sort of thing.

 

[Sierra1]

It's not a low compression bike. She'll run, and run well, on regular grade. But, "I" think she runs better on the premium stuff.

 

[Darren70]

Hey guys. I pulled the spark plugs and had a look. Checked all the intake boots and connections. Everything looks great with no surprises. I drained the mystery gas and refilled it with fresh premium, and all seems well with no pinging. It was still pinging on my way to the gas station and stopped almost immediately after filling it up. I guess I can assume it had some bad gas in it at purchase. It smelled ok, but who knows. Alls quiet now. I want to thank everyone who took the time to reply to my post ! Much appreciated.