HARD START
- Thread starter Dirt_Dad
- Start date
Not sure "sitting" has much to do with it.
So how old are our PDP bikes? 5 years?
I had a couple of episodes of "hard start" and both were, in my opinion, from not successfully starting on the first attempt. (unintentional release of starter button before she fired up properly)
Both occasions were solved with WOT, though once required a battery boost.
But as for sitting? I know this might be hard for some to believe, but I just let mine sit for about 11 months in the barn. (Shamefully)
I did NOT have it on a tender either. I did have fuel treatment.
I fully did NOT expect it to start. And it was a sad, feeble, crank for that weak battery. But she LIT!
Bike is just amazing.
(By the way, I tried a couple of other bikes first. Both Orange, if you know what I mean. They all had sat. I'm just saying)
So how old are our PDP bikes? 5 years?
I had a couple of episodes of "hard start" and both were, in my opinion, from not successfully starting on the first attempt. (unintentional release of starter button before she fired up properly)
Both occasions were solved with WOT, though once required a battery boost.
But as for sitting? I know this might be hard for some to believe, but I just let mine sit for about 11 months in the barn. (Shamefully)
I did NOT have it on a tender either. I did have fuel treatment.
I fully did NOT expect it to start. And it was a sad, feeble, crank for that weak battery. But she LIT!
Bike is just amazing.
(By the way, I tried a couple of other bikes first. Both Orange, if you know what I mean. They all had sat. I'm just saying)
If this was going to be just another hard start thread, no problem with renewing the conversation, but we are going to merge it with one of the existing threads. But I see it as a question about the new bikes SO
please include the model year of your bike in responses to this thread. It'll be helpful for everybody.
Thanks
please include the model year of your bike in responses to this thread. It'll be helpful for everybody.
Thanks
TomZ
Member
Having experienced the hard start several times on my 2012 ST, I knew what to do when my 2015 bike (yes it's flashed) started to show the same symptoms. I immediately stopped cranking and turned it off. Then set the kill switch on, let the bike sit for a couple of minutes, tried starting again and it fired up right away. This avoided having to use WOT.
The problem seems to arise after the bike has been started and then immediately turned off with the key before allowing it to warm up. It's only happened to me once in 29K miles.
The problem seems to arise after the bike has been started and then immediately turned off with the key before allowing it to warm up. It's only happened to me once in 29K miles.
Velvet
El lobo solitario
I haven't had it happen on my '14 as of yet. Maybe I'll have to try and induce the problem sometime to see if it will occur.
2daMax
Active Member
I always thought the hard start issue is a thing for cold climates but was wrong. Got a friend who left it sitting for 5 months. This is the tropics. He could not start n he message me. Told him the wot procedures but it didn't work. He says smells of fuel. Told him to pull the fuse trick but didn't work. Told him to press the start button not more than 5 secs each time n let rest for a minute to cool off the starter relay. He did this a few times, plug back the efi fuse n then press the start button. Fired up with heavy fuel smell. He was probably the happiest guy at that moment.
Doesn't appear to be any climate correlation, but it certainly seems to be a cold-start problem vs. a hot-start problem. The issue is weirdly random, although an "interrupted start" does appear to be a common factor. But even this isn't definitive as you can't reliably replicate the problem by deliberately interrupting a start and there have been LOTS of instances of the hard start with no interrupted start.2daMax said:
- Mark
Cycledude
Well-Known Member
My 13 did it only once , that was after sitting for about 3 weeks, after some monkeying around tried wot and it started right up, not really sure why it happened but I suspect the to small factory battery might contribute to the problem, when my battery needs replacing I will be buying one with more cold cranking amps. Another thing is when it happened to me the bike had fired once but did not start, once it fires the headlights come on which robs power for starting, thinking back after it fired and didn't start I probably should have turned the key off then back on to reset the headlights to off so they were not robing power for starting, I never owned a bike with that type of headlight-starting system before so it's a kinda new live and learn system for me.
Again - For this thread
POST THE YEAR OF THE BIKE YOU REFER TO
POST THE YEAR OF THE BIKE YOU REFER TO
KevinFH
New Member
Re: HARD TO START
OK, so I had a problem starting twice separated by about 6 months which is just long enough for me to forget what happened.
It is possible to turn the ignition key so that it is just not quite turned all the way to the up-down ON position. In this almost-ON position, it seems like everything is normal except that the bike will just crank and crank without starting.
If it happens again, try to remember this. Good luck remembering; I didn't.
OK, so I had a problem starting twice separated by about 6 months which is just long enough for me to forget what happened.
It is possible to turn the ignition key so that it is just not quite turned all the way to the up-down ON position. In this almost-ON position, it seems like everything is normal except that the bike will just crank and crank without starting.
If it happens again, try to remember this. Good luck remembering; I didn't.
HBLQRider
New Member
Re: HARD TO START
My stuck in Lake Isabella because the bike wouldn't start thread is locked so I'm posting here. I was able to finally get my bike started. The camp host had a car battery charger and charged it for about three plus hours. Then I hooked jumper cables up from one moto to mine. Thanks to you guys on this forum, the second it started turning I went all WOT on the beast and she reluctantly fired up!
This forum is awesome. Thanks guys!
My stuck in Lake Isabella because the bike wouldn't start thread is locked so I'm posting here. I was able to finally get my bike started. The camp host had a car battery charger and charged it for about three plus hours. Then I hooked jumper cables up from one moto to mine. Thanks to you guys on this forum, the second it started turning I went all WOT on the beast and she reluctantly fired up!
This forum is awesome. Thanks guys!
tomatocity
Active Member
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Re: HARD TO START
How is the weather at Lake Isabella? I have been wanting to ride M-56 or M-90, California Hot Springs, Sherman Pass, Kennedy Meadows, 9 Mile Canyon Rd. Just checked the elevation of Sherman Pass, 9200 ft. Guess snow still is present. I can wait. Will ride Kern Canyon Rd, Bodfish, Twin Oaks, Keene, Tehachapi.
Congratulations on getting it started. Being stranded sucks. One thing I have learned in 75,000 miles of Super Tenere (Gen1 and Gen2) is do not touch the throttle before or when starting.HBLQRider said:
How is the weather at Lake Isabella? I have been wanting to ride M-56 or M-90, California Hot Springs, Sherman Pass, Kennedy Meadows, 9 Mile Canyon Rd. Just checked the elevation of Sherman Pass, 9200 ft. Guess snow still is present. I can wait. Will ride Kern Canyon Rd, Bodfish, Twin Oaks, Keene, Tehachapi.
HBLQRider
New Member
Re: HARD TO START
In the end, I learned a valuable lesson. Never break camp until you know your bike is going to start. Second, when your friends tease you because you brought jumper cables...laugh at them for being unprepared! ;D
To your question about the roads... We bumped into a Highway Patrolman at a gas station and he said we could not get to the higher elevations as snow was present. I rode in from the Inyokern side up 178. Fantastic road. We camped at Pioneer Point off 155. It was okay, not well kept. But, we basically had the place to ourselves. Went into Kernville one night for dinner. We went into Bodfish and up and out of there on 483 all the way to Caliente and back. Came across a small road on the way back that said "Road Closed." What to do, what to do? Anyhow, I don't know the name of the closed road but it looked great on the map. I am not familiar with the whole area as it was my first visit and I was just following my buddy who planned the trip.
Anyhow, We rode out of there West bound on the 178 and cut through the ag lands until we got to the base of the Grapevine. Overall a great 3 day weekend.
Thanks for the info. I never give it any throttle when I start it either. (I only tried a quarter throttle when she wouldn't fire up). In hindsight my guess is a few things contributed to my challenges: I was too lazy to get a new battery when in my mind I kept saying get a new battery. I have a 2013. Second, it was cold at night and really wet. Third, two of the other guys had really loud bikes and had already started theirs and I couldn't hear my scoot. Also, being a non-mechanical kind of guy I always just turn the key and press the starter. I read on here you are supposed to wait a few seconds after you turn the key.tomatocity said:
In the end, I learned a valuable lesson. Never break camp until you know your bike is going to start. Second, when your friends tease you because you brought jumper cables...laugh at them for being unprepared! ;D
To your question about the roads... We bumped into a Highway Patrolman at a gas station and he said we could not get to the higher elevations as snow was present. I rode in from the Inyokern side up 178. Fantastic road. We camped at Pioneer Point off 155. It was okay, not well kept. But, we basically had the place to ourselves. Went into Kernville one night for dinner. We went into Bodfish and up and out of there on 483 all the way to Caliente and back. Came across a small road on the way back that said "Road Closed." What to do, what to do? Anyhow, I don't know the name of the closed road but it looked great on the map. I am not familiar with the whole area as it was my first visit and I was just following my buddy who planned the trip.
Anyhow, We rode out of there West bound on the 178 and cut through the ag lands until we got to the base of the Grapevine. Overall a great 3 day weekend.
Re: HARD TO START
Here's my hard start story...The bike is a first generation 2012 with 19K on it now. The first no start occurred about a year or so into it's life. I started to tear into it to see why it wouldn't start and then I remembered it's under warranty... let Yamaha deal with it. So I had it flatbedded down to the dealer thinking this should be covered. Turns out, I got a bill for $250 to get it started and no hope for getting it covered by Yamaha. No problems for a couple of years... until last summer 2016. It wouldn't start one day. Exactly the same scenario and symptoms as the first time it happened. Cold start, will pop a couple of times into the intake but just won't start. Battery gets weaker and weaker. I was involved in a garage building project at my house so I just stuck it into a storage trailer and moved on. Every now and then...like a month or two later, I would go out and try to start it, but to no avail. Pops a couple of times, cranks till the battery starts to wither, so I quit. I don't have time to deal with it so I close up the trailer and move on. 6 months goes by. Finally I decide today is the day I'm gonna get this thing started. I haven't been on this site for a couple of years so I do the research to see if Yamaha has tried to sort it out and find we're still in the same condition as we were 5 years ago...no real solution. From what I read, everyone is eventually able to start their bike eventually. So at someone's suggestion in this thread, I hook the car up to the bike with jumper cables and leave the car running. After a full 45 seconds of WOT cranking, the bike finally comes to life.
So now I know that I need to carry jumper cables and a car with me from now on. This doesn't give me a great deal of confidence in the bike, especially if I were traveling solo in a remote area.
Thanks for all the great help in the thread, but really someone from Yamaha needs to sort this thing out. BTW...I'm an automobile mechanic and have pretty good knowledge of mechanical stuff. This is not a basic engine flooded scenario caused by operator error. Just saying....
Here's my hard start story...The bike is a first generation 2012 with 19K on it now. The first no start occurred about a year or so into it's life. I started to tear into it to see why it wouldn't start and then I remembered it's under warranty... let Yamaha deal with it. So I had it flatbedded down to the dealer thinking this should be covered. Turns out, I got a bill for $250 to get it started and no hope for getting it covered by Yamaha. No problems for a couple of years... until last summer 2016. It wouldn't start one day. Exactly the same scenario and symptoms as the first time it happened. Cold start, will pop a couple of times into the intake but just won't start. Battery gets weaker and weaker. I was involved in a garage building project at my house so I just stuck it into a storage trailer and moved on. Every now and then...like a month or two later, I would go out and try to start it, but to no avail. Pops a couple of times, cranks till the battery starts to wither, so I quit. I don't have time to deal with it so I close up the trailer and move on. 6 months goes by. Finally I decide today is the day I'm gonna get this thing started. I haven't been on this site for a couple of years so I do the research to see if Yamaha has tried to sort it out and find we're still in the same condition as we were 5 years ago...no real solution. From what I read, everyone is eventually able to start their bike eventually. So at someone's suggestion in this thread, I hook the car up to the bike with jumper cables and leave the car running. After a full 45 seconds of WOT cranking, the bike finally comes to life.
So now I know that I need to carry jumper cables and a car with me from now on. This doesn't give me a great deal of confidence in the bike, especially if I were traveling solo in a remote area.
Thanks for all the great help in the thread, but really someone from Yamaha needs to sort this thing out. BTW...I'm an automobile mechanic and have pretty good knowledge of mechanical stuff. This is not a basic engine flooded scenario caused by operator error. Just saying....
tomatocity
Active Member
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Re: HARD TO START
Good to hear you got it started.
Couple questions...
... is this the original 5.5 year old battery?
... do you keep the battery charged with a Battery Tender?
... how old was the gasoline when you were trying to start?
... does the gasoline have an additive for storage/performance?
... had you moved the throttle prior to attempting to start? Has been documented to not touch the throttle prior to starting. One hint is to use your left hand thumb/finger to start your Tenere.
... if you replace the battery replace it with a YUASA YTZ14S. Same price, same size, bit more cranking power.
... the Cam Chain Tensioner (CCT) is a common problem with the 2012 Tenere and a good Yamaha shop will replace it under warranty.
... properly tuned Throttle Bodies (TB) helps the engine tune. A well tuned engine starts easier.
... my 2012 had EXCESSIVE carbon buildup that was part of the cause when it blew up. Now I usually add "Engine Med - Advanced Ethanol Corrosion Protection & Engine De-Carboning". Purchased locally.
Hope this helps.
Good to hear you got it started.
Couple questions...
... is this the original 5.5 year old battery?
... do you keep the battery charged with a Battery Tender?
... how old was the gasoline when you were trying to start?
... does the gasoline have an additive for storage/performance?
... had you moved the throttle prior to attempting to start? Has been documented to not touch the throttle prior to starting. One hint is to use your left hand thumb/finger to start your Tenere.
... if you replace the battery replace it with a YUASA YTZ14S. Same price, same size, bit more cranking power.
... the Cam Chain Tensioner (CCT) is a common problem with the 2012 Tenere and a good Yamaha shop will replace it under warranty.
... properly tuned Throttle Bodies (TB) helps the engine tune. A well tuned engine starts easier.
... my 2012 had EXCESSIVE carbon buildup that was part of the cause when it blew up. Now I usually add "Engine Med - Advanced Ethanol Corrosion Protection & Engine De-Carboning". Purchased locally.
Hope this helps.
Re: HARD TO START
Hello tomatocity...thanks for the thoughtful reply.
...It is the original battery, although when the problem first happened, the battery was 2 years old theoretically.
...I do keep the battery on a tender.
...The gasoline was fresh when the problem occured last summer and when it first occurred at two years. Of course after six months sitting in the storage container it was not. I considered this might be complicating the problem but still felt the bike should start. My WR starts without a hitch...knock on wood.
...The gasoline did not have an additive in it because the problem occurred before I was ready to put the bike up for the season. And then wonder if its worth adding it if it isn't in the fuel rail because I can't start it. Anyways, it was without conditioner.
...I think I inadvertently slipped off the starter button and stopped cranking before it started and then began cranking again. I doubt I was messing with the throttle because I know enough to know about fuel injection and throttle activity. I assume this vehicle has a clear flood mode when in WOT position but not sure. I'm sure at some point when the problem happened I tried that.
I do get a lot, lot of clacking when the bike is first started and assumed that is the timing chain tensioner. I'll see if I can get that covered under warranty. I let my extended coverage expire...do you think that they may still cover it?
Thanks for your help!
Hello tomatocity...thanks for the thoughtful reply.
...It is the original battery, although when the problem first happened, the battery was 2 years old theoretically.
...I do keep the battery on a tender.
...The gasoline was fresh when the problem occured last summer and when it first occurred at two years. Of course after six months sitting in the storage container it was not. I considered this might be complicating the problem but still felt the bike should start. My WR starts without a hitch...knock on wood.
...The gasoline did not have an additive in it because the problem occurred before I was ready to put the bike up for the season. And then wonder if its worth adding it if it isn't in the fuel rail because I can't start it. Anyways, it was without conditioner.
...I think I inadvertently slipped off the starter button and stopped cranking before it started and then began cranking again. I doubt I was messing with the throttle because I know enough to know about fuel injection and throttle activity. I assume this vehicle has a clear flood mode when in WOT position but not sure. I'm sure at some point when the problem happened I tried that.
I do get a lot, lot of clacking when the bike is first started and assumed that is the timing chain tensioner. I'll see if I can get that covered under warranty. I let my extended coverage expire...do you think that they may still cover it?
Thanks for your help!
2daMax
Active Member
Re: HARD TO START
I usually leave the kill switch to OFF when I turn the key on. this is what I gather to avoid hard start issues.
I usually leave the kill switch to OFF when I turn the key on. this is what I gather to avoid hard start issues.
RED CAT
New Member
Re: HARD TO START
Had a sorta hard start on my 2014 yesterday. Been sitting a couple weeks. Hit starter and it turns over but doesn't want to catch. Do it twice more, no go. OK, Hold throttle 3/4 open and hit start. Bam, fires right up.
Had a sorta hard start on my 2014 yesterday. Been sitting a couple weeks. Hit starter and it turns over but doesn't want to catch. Do it twice more, no go. OK, Hold throttle 3/4 open and hit start. Bam, fires right up.
Re: HARD TO START
First start of the season on a Gen2 bike that's sat for a little, my guess is that it's probably a different issue than the Gen1 bikes have had. The big question is whether it keeps having an issue.
First start of the season on a Gen2 bike that's sat for a little, my guess is that it's probably a different issue than the Gen1 bikes have had. The big question is whether it keeps having an issue.