Hard start fix coming from Yamaha

[KCW]

I have been told by the factory that Yamaha is aware of the hard start issue, and is working on a fix. Yamaha says it is caused by a mixture rich condition caused by a bug in the ECU. In early 2016, Yamaha is supposedly coming out with an ECU software fix that will remedy the issue. In the meantime, these are the instructions that supposedly will get a bike that fails to start, started:

(1) Identify hard start and stop cranking
(2) Turn kill switch to "kill" position
(3) Turn off key
(4) Wait 5 seconds
(5) Turn on key
(6) Turn kill switch to "run" and IMMEDIATELY start cranking
(7) Bike starts

The supposed ECU software fix that is coming makes me wonder what will happen to all of those with flashed bikes? Is anyone aware whether the engine software and throttle mapping are stored separately on the ECU? If not, I assume those with flashed bikes will lose their throttle maps if they apply this manufacturer ECU software modification. Is anyone able to confirm?

 

[JRE]

Excellent - thanks!

 

[squarebore]

This is fantastic news! Not only will we get a fix for the hard start but acceptance that the condition actually exists. Lost count of how many times the forum experts have told me and others that it is "normal" or that it is induced by the rider. Vindication that I'm not an idiot ( well for this issue anyway).

 

[TheHelios]

Source?

 

[KCW]

Source?

Masaki Kobashigawa, Chief Powerplant Engineer, Yamaha.

 

[groundhog]

Sounds like that's come from a man who knows !!! good news !

 

[Maxified]

The supposed ECU software fix that is coming makes me wonder what will happen to all of those with flashed bikes? Is anyone aware whether the engine software and throttle mapping are stored separately on the ECU? If not, I assume those with flashed bikes will lose their throttle maps if they apply this manufacturer ECU software modification. Is anyone able to confirm?

Thanks for the info. I have had two hard starts over the 4 years I've had the machine. I also have an ACV flashed ECU so I am very interested i how this pans out.

 

[scott123007]

That's great news, guys., but don't get too excited that this "in the meantime" remedy is going to be a cure all. It will probably work "if" it is one of the more minor hard starts, but there are many levels of "hard start" all the way to "no start", ranging from "I held the throttle WOT for a few seconds and it started" to removing the fuel pump fuse, and still having to wait a couple of days for it to air out enough. I can assure you that if you experience the "no start", there is no way in hell that's going to start the bike. Hopefully, they can sort the ECU and flash all of us with the update, and everything up until now will become nothing but a bad memory.

 

[Bappo]

Haha. Just read this after posting my hard start in the other section. I used the kill switch off, turn key on, kill switch on and start with WOT. Started up in about 4 seconds.

YEA!

 

[78YZ]

The supposed ECU software fix that is coming makes me wonder what will happen to all of those with flashed bikes?

This is an important question. I love my flashed bike.

 

[TXTenere]

This is an important question. I love my flashed bike.

Supposing this is all factual, do you love your flashed bike enough to deal with the hard start? Or, to pay for the flash again, to get the revised ECU software, with the flashed ECU (if that's an option?)

 

[simmons1]

This is an important question. I love my flashed bike.

I agree.

Having said that, my ECU Unleashed Flashed, Power commander tuned bike has never experienced a hard start in the 4 years and 33K miles I have owned it.

 

[78YZ]

Supposing this is all factual, do you love your flashed bike enough to deal with the hard start? Or, to pay for the flash again, to get the revised ECU software, with the flashed ECU (if that's an option?)

So far, I've not had the hard start problem... knock on wood! ::26::

 

[2daMax]

This hard start thing had me worrying before I got the S10. Now that I have it, I have the Kill switch set to "KILL" before turning to ON on the key. After the cycle diagnostic is over, I turn on the KILL switch and hit the starter. The fuel pump is not primed during the start cycle. I hope I will never ever face a hard start issue.

 

[Philistine]

I have been told by the factory that Yamaha is aware of the hard start issue, and is working on a fix. Yamaha says it is caused by a mixture rich condition caused by a bug in the ECU. In early 2016, Yamaha is supposedly coming out with an ECU software fix that will remedy the issue. In the meantime, these are the instructions that supposedly will get a bike that fails to start, started:

(1) Identify hard start and stop cranking
(2) Turn kill switch to "kill" position
(3) Turn off key
(4) Wait 5 seconds
(5) Turn on key
(6) Turn kill switch to "run" and IMMEDIATELY start cranking
(7) Bike starts

The supposed ECU software fix that is coming makes me wonder what will happen to all of those with flashed bikes? Is anyone aware whether the engine software and throttle mapping are stored separately on the ECU? If not, I assume those with flashed bikes will lose their throttle maps if they apply this manufacturer ECU software modification. Is anyone able to confirm?

So do we use WOT or not with this Procedure :question: :-\

 

[JRE]

The supposed ECU software fix that is coming makes me wonder what will happen to all of those with flashed bikes? Is anyone aware whether the engine software and throttle mapping are stored separately on the ECU? If not, I assume those with flashed bikes will lose their throttle maps if they apply this manufacturer ECU software modification. Is anyone able to confirm?

That's a great question

This hard start thing had me worrying before I got the S10. Now that I have it, I have the Kill switch set to "KILL" before turning to ON on the key. After the cycle diagnostic is over, I turn on the KILL switch and hit the starter. The fuel pump is not primed during the start cycle. I hope I will never ever face a hard start issue.

That's probably a smart practice.

 

[camardelle]

This hard start thing had me worrying before I got the S10. Now that I have it, I have the Kill switch set to "KILL" before turning to ON on the key. After the cycle diagnostic is over, I turn on the KILL switch and hit the starter. The fuel pump is not primed during the start cycle. I hope I will never ever face a hard start issue.

What is the purpose of this? I know that when I turn on my key it seems like a ton of fuel gets sent to the motor? Does this procedure stop that process?

 

[EricV]

Some are of the opinion that the kill switch is for emergencies only. Others feel that it is part of the normal routine. So shutting the bike down with the kill switch is a habit for some of us. Thus, key on, wait for the gauge sweep to finish, then kill switch to run, then start button is the normal routine. It's all conjecture about the hard start at this point.

I've had it on both my FJR and the S10. The main issue that cause the hard start are shutting down the bike before it's fully warmed up. In some conditions, if you accidentally kill the engine during the warm up cycle, it will induce a hard start. Shutting the bike off, key off, kill switch to kill, then waiting and trying again does one thing for sure, it shuts off the headlights again so you have more voltage to crank the motor with. This routine has worked for me with varying amounts of throttle.

I've had it not be an issue at all when I killed the motor, (forgot to put the side stand up and dropped it into gear), and it re-started just fine in the normal manner. I've had two occasions where the bike was parked outside for the night while traveling, (under a half cover), and it was pretty cold. Fired up fine, but due to the loose gravel and steep incline of the driveway I was trying to exit, plus me being bundled up pretty good, I accidentally killed the motor twice while getting from the parking lot to the road on a fully laden bike. Welcome to hard start! First time in maybe 20F it fired up easily with some throttle opening and the next cranking. The other time, perhaps 40F, raining hard and higher elevation, it did NOT want to fire with WOT. However, after I shut everything down again and pushed the beast about 50 yards to where I had it on the road and tried again, essentially mimic-ing the OP "Yamaha approved" method, it finally coughed to life and I had no other issues during that month long trip.

 

[jimmy z]

2012 with 31k on the clock.Has been flashed.No hard starts ever.Yamaha can have my e.c.u. when they pry it from my cold bloody dead hands.Jim

 

[HeliMark]

I know I shouldn't say this, but in 22K miles, I have never had a hard start. And I have started and shut it down several times in the conditions that have been described. Guess I have been lucky (until now?).

But let me try this on the numerous people here that are a lot smarter than I am with the mechanics of this bike.

Yamaha has apparently identified an issue with the fueling during start and is modifying the fuel map to "correct" it. Which they say will do away with the hard start problem. Ignoring the issue of a person who through their own doing, floods the bike, why is this not a "possible" fix. The ECM is looking at the engine temp, OAT, etc. At some point between a cold start and a warmed engine start, the ECM enriches the actual fuel more than required to start because the fuel map said to do that under the conditions it is presented with. Whatever that point is, which could be a very narrow area, is too much and you have the hard start. This may be what Yamaha calls a bug in the software. It seems to me that Yamaha has identified at least one issue that may contribute to the problem and is "fixing" it, or am I wrong?

Mark