Fort Worth, Texas Accident. Hope everyone and their family are ok!

SHUMBA

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Don't know how many vehicles, but the little town here, 39k population, averages about 10 fatalities per year.
Depending upon what your climate is like is a big big factor
If you have a lot of snow, ice etc., then that can and does lead to a higher accident/death rate.
Another factor is the volume of traffic, population density, along with the budget for policing/enforcement.
I'm in Ontario, Canada and if you're caught driving/riding 50 kph over the posted speed limit, the police will roadside suspend your drivers license and seize your car for 7 days. Including a hefty fine $2,000 or so.
Alcohol is still, sadly a cause of traffic injuries and fatalities even though it carries stiff penalties.
Canada is geographically a large country and the enforcement is few and far between. We have a lot of very good paved county roads where I live.
One can really have some fun on a fast bike. It's in the small towns, villages etc. where you will likely encounter a police patrol.
Bottom line, have fun, use your head, and learn how to and wear to "blow off" a little steam on your bike.
SHUMBA

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JJTJ2

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Lake of the Ozarks, Missouri
Compared to here my friend.
On my first drive of 800km here I saw three dead by collision, heavies and buses overtaking on approach to brows, bends and oncoming vehicles forced off the road by buses when they could be clearly seen on a 1 kilometer straight. I personally had to stop once and leave the road once on entry to a bend.

I make swift progress and don't miss many overtakes, but I was being overtaken where only someone with a death wish or a firm belief that rubbing a cross really can ensure you get to your destination. Delivery trucks overtaking a 2004 "unicorn'' STi Forester and the clear expectation I would shoehorn them out of whatever situation they barreled into - which I did.

WARNING!!! do not watch if easily upset (ADMIN please remove if not suitable viewing...)


Unfortunately there is often someone doing something borderline dangerous approximately every 5 km or less. Great training ground though.
I am always amazed at the level of chaos at the driving in Asia. What is the reasoning behind this? Surely the population can see the dangers behind this kind of driving?
 

Sierra1

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I am always amazed at the level of chaos at the driving in Asia. What is the reasoning behind this? Surely the population can see the dangers behind this kind of driving?
Seeing the dangers. . . . doesn't mean that they understand the dangers. It's the ol' "it won't happen to me" thing. Once again, not exclusive to Asia. I also think that SHUMBA is likely correct about the lack of enforcement being a contributing factor.
 

SHUMBA

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Nope. . . . we just drive like idiots.
Ha ha....y'all got a 80 MPH or 130 KPH speed limit in Texas....
Envious.....I remember driving through Montana many years ago and there was no daytime speed limit on the I-road. Whoooo!!
Our fastest speed limit here in Ontario Canada is 110 KPH. or just shy of 70 MPH.
This past riding season was a blast as due to covid, the police were mostly ignoring speeders, particularly motorcycles..our State Troopers, or we call them Provincial Police have a policy stating they are forbidden to chase a motorcycle, unless of course one has committed a serious crime.
Best not to run tho.
By the time the patrol car gets turned around begins to follow you, I once gassed it and disappeared down a county road at a great rate....stopped in a quiet area and removed my hi-viz vest and continued riding.
Just a technique, really don't recommend it.
A GPS is an asset and familiarity with the area is a must.
SHUMBA


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SHUMBA

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Seeing the dangers. . . . doesn't mean that they understand the dangers. It's the ol' "it won't happen to me" thing. Once again, not exclusive to Asia. I also think that SHUMBA is likely correct about the lack of enforcement being a contributing factor.
Yup, nothing like human nature.
Enforcement, depending on where you are...some cities or counties are big on enforcement, cause it a big revenue generator....
SHUMBA

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PhilPhilippines

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Philippines
Seeing the dangers. . . . doesn't mean that they understand the dangers. It's the ol' "it won't happen to me" thing. Once again, not exclusive to Asia. I also think that SHUMBA is likely correct about the lack of enforcement being a contributing factor.
You are both correct. There are obviously many contributing factors but mainly boils down to attitude, as 75% of collisions are attributable human error could be avoided.

Enforcement: I often encounter Filipinos that double down on the chaotic road situation being irreversible here. I point out to them that virtually all Filipinos can change their attitude and driving instantly to make driving safer and more pleasurable. The self-entitled attitude that prevails throughout the majority of the Philippines invariably stops as soon as they enter Subic. Subic has enforcers that jump on any violation and make flouting the law an expensive and time consuming proposition. When I mention Subic it is always a moment of ''oh yeah....." enlightenment.

Understanding the dangers: The other common problem is the the worldwide Shaggy "Wasn't Me" attitude. Weather, others actions, etc, are all pointed at when something unexpected happens. The key word is "unexpected", as we should all look to ourselves for answers to why a close call or collision occurs - what was my contribution to getting into that scenario...what did I miss? Self-reflection is a great tool for improvement and avoidance of repeating the same error again. If you do not have the ability to analyze what your contribution to the shock moment was, the probability of repetition is pretty much 100% guaranteed.

I am often driving/riding at half the speed (or less) of others here in hazard rich environments. The ability of 90% of the road users (pedestrians, drivers, riders) to wander/ride/drive into situations without thinking about what is happening and expecting others to sort everything out is commonplace.

Then, of course there are the machismo, look-at-me element that feel they are impervious to the laws of Nature understeering into the scenery (let Darwin sort that one out).

Anyone interested in self-preservation would do well to read: Mind Driving: New Skills for Staying Alive on the Road [Haley, Stephen]. The majority of the content is known but can improve your life expectancy immeasurably if you need a tweak here and there. Also, the entry level guide to the building blocks to becoming a well-rounded rider with a proven systematic approach are the Roadcraft publications: Motorcycle Roadcraft - The Police Rider's Handbook [The Police Foundation]
 

PhilPhilippines

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I am always amazed at the level of chaos at the driving in Asia. What is the reasoning behind this? Surely the population can see the dangers behind this kind of driving?
No driving culture? No incentive to improve? Resistance to change? Attitude?

The first driving school in the UK was 1909. US was 1930s. They call them driving schools here but I've lost count of the number of times I have encountered instructors that are instructing incorrectly. Concerned, I politely spoke to an instructor trainer here at a national driving school - it turned out he did not have the knowledge a provisional licence holder would be expected to have in the UK.

I went to the LTO head office here to do my driving tests. I chose to do the tests myself and not pay a fixer. The tests:

1) Written test - ambiguous questions, incorrect answers, two viable options as answers, road signs on the wall with the description. Question (1) When following a vehicle should you be:
a) one car length
b) two car lengths
c) three car lengths
I approached the LTO member of staff and asked what speed I would I be doing. 0 or 100?
Passed

2) Motorcycle test - No helmet, ride twice in a circle, avoid wandering Filipinos. LTO provided a twist and go, belching plumes of two-stroke. It had just about every panel flapping about where, presumably, candidates had avoided normal forward movement and face-planted. On getting on the bike I found that both brakes barely worked and on twisting the throttle found that it was sticking(?) and was either 100% or zero%. OK, on/off throttle, circle became an octagonal shape.
Passed

3) Driving test - provided my own manual vehicle. Examiner chatting to someone, me waiting patiently. Eventually, I interrupted and was informed I should get in my vehicle. Got in, patiently waited, examiner still chatting. Got out and politely asked when he would be accompanying me. Was told that I would drive 20ish meters, turn around and come back. I asked whether he would be watching me drive, my footwork etc, but I was informed - without sitting alongside me - he "knew".

I got in, did my pre-drive checks and drove the 20 meters, turned round and drove back. However, something felt very wrong. Somehow, on getting into the car my feet had got all crossed up and my right foot was operating the clutch and my left foot was operating the gas and brake!! I got out and enquired if everything was ok as I thought my feet felt odd. But, no need to worry, happily he knew what was required to drive safely in the Philippines and stated - to my obvious relief - that I had passed. :D

"It's more fun in the Philippines" 1613730693724.png
 

Checkswrecks

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I am always amazed at the level of chaos at the driving in Asia. What is the reasoning behind this? Surely the population can see the dangers behind this kind of driving?
It's not just Asia, it's most of the world and when there are accidents they come from not a lack of enforcement but a lack of raw MONEY. You're writing from a place of putting money into the entire transportation infrastructure of roads, signals, training and license, police for enforcement, etc. It takes tax money to have the things we in the west enjoy, especially as things get more congested.

Once you've done it for a while and understand true fender driving, it actually all works till you encounter some of the problems Phil mentioned. I actually kinda enjoy it after the first stressful day or two and get into the rhythm.
 

SHUMBA

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You are both correct. There are obviously many contributing factors but mainly boils down to attitude, as 75% of collisions are attributable human error could be avoided.

Enforcement: I often encounter Filipinos that double down on the chaotic road situation being irreversible here. I point out to them that virtually all Filipinos can change their attitude and driving instantly to make driving safer and more pleasurable. The self-entitled attitude that prevails throughout the majority of the Philippines invariably stops as soon as they enter Subic. Subic has enforcers that jump on any violation and make flouting the law an expensive and time consuming proposition. When I mention Subic it is always a moment of ''oh yeah....." enlightenment.

Understanding the dangers: The other common problem is the the worldwide Shaggy "Wasn't Me" attitude. Weather, others actions, etc, are all pointed at when something unexpected happens. The key word is "unexpected", as we should all look to ourselves for answers to why a close call or collision occurs - what was my contribution to getting into that scenario...what did I miss? Self-reflection is a great tool for improvement and avoidance of repeating the same error again. If you do not have the ability to analyze what your contribution to the shock moment was, the probability of repetition is pretty much 100% guaranteed.

I am often driving/riding at half the speed (or less) of others here in hazard rich environments. The ability of 90% of the road users (pedestrians, drivers, riders) to wander/ride/drive into situations without thinking about what is happening and expecting others to sort everything out is commonplace.

Then, of course there are the machismo, look-at-me element that feel they are impervious to the laws of Nature understeering into the scenery (let Darwin sort that one out).

Anyone interested in self-preservation would do well to read: Mind Driving: New Skills for Staying Alive on the Road [Haley, Stephen]. The majority of the content is known but can improve your life expectancy immeasurably if you need a tweak here and there. Also, the entry level guide to the building blocks to becoming a well-rounded rider with a proven systematic approach are the Roadcraft publications: Motorcycle Roadcraft - The Police Rider's Handbook [The Police Foundation]
Gotta look into these books.
I'm a firm believer in learning how to ride properly and frequently practicing your riding skills by conducting manoeuvres in a quiet parking lot...
SHUMBA

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PhilPhilippines

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Gotta look into these books.
I'm a firm believer in learning how to ride properly and frequently practicing your riding skills by conducting manoeuvres in a quiet parking lot...
SHUMBA

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Gotta warn you. They're not a sexy read. But full of insight and knowledge. Roadcraft systems of vehicle control have been refined over decades and police forces worldwide have visited the Met Police Proving Grounds at Hendon over the years to glean more insight into the techniques used.
 

SHUMBA

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Gotta warn you. They're not a sexy read. But full of insight and knowledge. Roadcraft systems of vehicle control have been refined over decades and police forces worldwide have visited the Met Police Proving Grounds at Hendon over the years to glean more insight into the techniques used.
Yup, nothing better than a well trained motor officer. Don't try and outside one.
The majority of riders I know, after they get their motorcycle license, they cease to practice rider techniques and continue to learn and then they don't ride very often, hence their riding skillsets diminish to very poor levels.
I think all riders owe it to themselves to take a little "refresher training" at the beginning of a new riding season. Even if it means going to a vacant parking lot and practice a few maneuvers. Have a buddy coach you.
Having said this, rider courses, other than the abinitio (learners) courses are few and far between here in
SHUMBA




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Sierra1

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Yup, nothing better than a well trained motor officer. Don't try and outside one.
The majority of riders I know, after they get their motorcycle license, they cease to practice rider techniques and continue to learn and then they don't ride very often, hence their riding skillsets diminish to very poor levels.
I think all riders owe it to themselves to take a little "refresher training" at the beginning of a new riding season. Even if it means going to a vacant parking lot and practice a few maneuvers. Have a buddy coach you. . . .
Yeah, it bugs me when someone tells me that they've ridden bikes their whole life. . . . and the last time they rode was 10 years ago. Just because you started as a kid, doesn't mean you've been riding your whole life. Back when I was working, and I returned from a short vacation, I could tell I had picked up some "rust". Of course it didn't take long to get rid of it, but if I got rusty in just a few weeks. . . . how much rust is do people get after a few months. . . . years?

My next door neighbor just bought an '04 VTX 1300. He is in his 70s. . . . and hasn't ridden since the '70s. He is a great guy, but has rolled two of his riding lawnmowers. He agreed to take the MSF course, (mandatory for a license in TX) but I saw him a couple days later taking of down the road.
 

SHUMBA

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Yeah, it bugs me when someone tells me that they've ridden bikes their whole life. . . . and the last time they rode was 10 years ago. Just because you started as a kid, doesn't mean you've been riding your whole life. Back when I was working, and I returned from a short vacation, I could tell I had picked up some "rust". Of course it didn't take long to get rid of it, but if I got rusty in just a few weeks. . . . how much rust is do people get after a few months. . . . years?

My next door neighbor just bought an '04 VTX 1300. He is in his 70s. . . . and hasn't ridden since the '70s. He is a great guy, but has rolled two of his riding lawnmowers. He agreed to take the MSF course, (mandatory for a license in TX) but I saw him a couple days later taking of down the road.
There are many like this, "oh yea, I've been a ridin for years and years" so "why y'all duck walkin in yo U turns?"
We know the answer, cause yo ain't current on yo bike....
I'm 70 and I rode in my teens, and into my 20's, then only a handful of scooter rentals on various holidays.
So five years ago, I reengaged into riding....I bought a gently used 250 Honda dual sport and it was my training wheels. From there I progressed to an litre bike, but I paid a bike instructor for some lessons.
Five years later, after a few drops I'm doing OK.
I frequently practice in a quiet area and do some manoeuvres on my bike.
SHUMBA

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Sierra1

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I got my license when I was 16. The only substantial periods of "no riding" that I've had was the months while out to sea. My kids got their license(s) at 16 also. My oldest rides his little pissed off bumble bee in all weather. His bike has been down for about two months. Something to do with waiting for a part, that is delayed due to covid, for his exhaust that broke.
 
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