Engine character?

[Nathan Wiley]

I'm currently researching for my next bike. Everything about the Super Tenere on paper looks great, suspension, ergos, brakes, etc. The only thing I'm having trouble wraping my head around is what the engine feels like. In magazine reviews I've read everything from the engine being dull, to coarse and noisy, to feeling like a big powerful single (which would be a good thing). I rarely agree with what magazines have said about the bikes I've personally owned in the past though.

The only other experience I have with a parallel twin was my last bike, a Kawasaki Versys. I didn't really care much for that engine. A bit too coarse and "cheap" feeling, and underpowered for the elevation here two-up. Before that I put 40,000 on a Honda ST1300 which has a jem of a V4. Before that a VStrom 1000 which had a nice engine but little else. SV650 before that....love that engine. I'm currently doing the dualsport thing with a WR250R.

I have little hope of finding a demo or rental here in southern Utah or even a Super Tenere on a showroom floor.

So.......what's the engine compare to? Buell, VStrom, KTM 990, powerful DR650, ?

And......anyone in southern Utah or maybe traveling through Cedar City wiiling to give me a 10 minute demo around the block?

 

[MidlifeMotor]

The best part about the ST if you are concerned about engine character is the fact it has two modes: Touring mode is very smooth but not quite as peppy, although it has plenty of punch. Want some more kick? Flip over to Sport mode and hang on!! I just love mine. Keep in mind I ride a Kawasaki Councours 14 (160 hp) for my police duty bike during the day, and I love riding my ST more!!

 

[Borghi]

I just traded my '08 DL1000 on a new S10. I had 18,000 mi on my Vee which I bought new. Loved the DL engine. Very smooth and fast once I added a Power Commander. When I was breaking in the S10, it seemed to be "rough" compared to the Suzuki . Now that I have some miles on it, it is getting much smoother. Along with the engine, the drive train is breaking in and also contributing to a smoother overall ride. In terms of raw power delivery, I think the DL had more "snap", but this was probably due to the chain drive and maybe a few more HP. As Nathan said, you have a choice between Touring mode or Sport. In Sport mode with traction control off, you definitely need to hold on when punching the throttle or the front wheel will come off the ground. Overall, the S10 has plenty of power for whatever you want to do, just not quite as snappy as I remember the DL1000 being. Gas mileage is much better than the DL. I have been getting 50+ mpg in mixed sport and touring driving.

 

[coastie]

It is clunky and noisy for the first few thousand miles, then it turns buttery smooth. I switched to synthetics between the 4 and 8 thousand mile services and this made a HUGE difference. I does have some lag in the throttle but is very easily ridden around or tuned out. If you like big thumpers, you will love the motor. It does not have rip your arms off HP but it certainly makes up for it with torque.

 

[jajpko]

The bike on a whole is really nice, but, the engine is noisy and sometimes will make you think something is broken. ::025::
Other than that, it is a great bike. You can by a flash or use a DynoJet Power Commander and really make this into a hot rod. Or,,, You can keep it stock and ride it. Either way it will do what you want. jmho

 

[Bullett]

Ha! Today, at approximately 400 miles, I decided the bike sounds like a big Ford truck V-8. ) Finally seem to have gotten the suspension sorted and my handlebar risers arrived! ::012::

Other than that, the bike handles really well with neutral steering. Since I'm still breaking it in, I haven't really gotten sporty with it, but I'm enjoying it on the mountain roads around here.

 

[Twisties]

Nathan, if you want to come to SLC you can probably get a short test ride from SouthValley MotorSports (call first to verify). Although I think it would be worth trying where you are if there is one in stock. The bike is much more available now and I bet you could find one in St George. Failing all that, provided you have helmet and gear, and are an experienced rider I would let you ride mine. But you would need to be quick as we are headed out of town shortly. You might also PM EricV on this board. He is in St. George with a Tenere.

 

[markjenn]

Nothing will substitute for a test ride. The engine makes Okay power, has a nice-flat torque curve, and is very friendly and versatile. But it is no rip-snorter up top and it can be a bit of a droner at times. I like it, but I do think the GS engine has more immediacy and character.

One oddity about the S10 is that vibes are dependent more on throttle position than RPM. (I've heard this is a characteristic of the crossplane crank config, both in twins and fours - people say the same about the R1.) In a tailwind or under light load, the engine seems totally effortless and glass smooth, even at very elevated RPM. But into a strong headwind or up a long-steep grade, it can seem a little vibey; nothing to worry about, but a definite contrast.

You need to take that test ride.

- Mark

 

[GrahamD]

One oddity about the S10 is that vibes are dependent more on throttle position than RPM. (I've heard this is a characteristic of the crossplane crank config, both in twins and fours - people say the same about the R1.) In a tailwind or under light load, the engine seems totally effortless and glass smooth, even at very elevated RPM. But into a strong headwind or up a long-steep grade, it can seem a little vibey; nothing to worry about, but a definite contrast.

You need to take that test ride.

- Mark

Ash did a really thorough explanation of the reasons for what you describe OFF throttle.

On throttle you have to take into account two big, close together pulses with a big lag.

http://www.ashonbikes.com/cross-plane_crank

And all the calculations that go with that article..(which is linked from the article)

http://www.ashonbikes.com/inertial_torque

And the slightly tosser video.. [The meat starts at 2:09]

2009 Yamaha YZF-R1 engine technology explanation

Cheers
Graham

 

[Tremor38]

Re: Re: Engine character?

Ha! Today, at approximately 400 miles, I decided the bike sounds like a big Ford truck V-8. ) Finally seem to have gotten the suspension sorted and my handlebar risers arrived! ::012::

Other than that, the bike handles really well with neutral steering. Since I'm still breaking it in, I haven't really gotten sporty with it, but I'm enjoying it on the mountain roads around here.

This is the first I've heard someone else other than myself characterize the exaust note that way. It sounds like my father's old 1960 T-bird with 352CI V-8. That's one of the reasons I don't mind the stock exhaust.
Sent from my F-05D using Tapatalk 2

 

[Nathan Wiley]

Thanks everyone for the responses so far.

I don't mind a vibey engine as long as it is a pleasant frequency. My previous SV650 and DL1000 could be considered very vibey but they had a "thud" to them that was very nice. My Versys on the other hand was the same size engine as the SV but it's vibes were more coarse and high frequency. I do find big singles like XR650s and DR650s have that "right" thump.

I guess I really need to find a demo. It's a big investment to take a chance on.

Somewhat off topic............I really wish dealers of Japanese brands were open to demos the way the European manufacturers are. I've never had a problem walking into a BMW, Ducati, Aprilia, etc., dealer and getting a demo. In fact they have often encouraged me to take a spin on something without even me asking. With bike prices rising higher and higher it seems ludicris for a manufacturer to expect a buyer to plop down 14-15k for a bike without a test drive. I've never bought a car, truck, SUV, without taking a thorough test drive down the freeway, through traffic, and up some grades. Once we started passing $10,000 for a new motorcycle we moved pass them being "toys". It's time motorcyclist enthusiasts were taken more seriously and treated accordingly.

 

[xnuke1]

I just bought my S10 2 weeks ago at South Valley Motorsports in Sandy. They have 2 or 3 S10's. The Black one is the Demo. I got one of the Blue ones. It may be a bit of a drive for you coming down from Cedar City, but if you are serious about the bike, they will let you test ride.

I had a Victory Kingpin, WR250x, Concours 14, and now have the Tenere and KLR650. The engine isn't as refined as the Concours nor does it have the character of the big V-twin. But I just put an Arrow slip on and clutch bypass mod. And now, Holy Crap! It will pull the bars out of your hands in S-mode if you snap the throttle. At first I was a little concerned I made the wrong choice of bike. But after putting on the can and pulling the DB killer and bypassing the clutch interlock, this bike is awesome.

So get on down to South Valley this week (weather should be fantastic) and get some seat time on it. Tell 'em Chris Ross sent ya. I get nothing from them, but have been in and out of their store riding anything and everything the last year and a half. And finally pulled the trigger on one of their bikes. Really great guys to work with.

 

[Twisties]

I just bought my S10 2 weeks ago at South Valley Motorsports in Sandy. They have 2 or 3 S10's. The Black one is the Demo. I got one of the Blue ones. It may be a bit of a drive for you coming down from Cedar City, but if you are serious about the bike, they will let you test ride.

I had a Victory Kingpin, WR250x, Concours 14, and now have the Tenere and KLR650. The engine isn't as refined as the Concours nor does it have the character of the big V-twin. But I just put an Arrow slip on and clutch bypass mod. And now, Holy Crap! It will pull the bars out of your hands in S-mode if you snap the throttle. At first I was a little concerned I made the wrong choice of bike. But after putting on the can and pulling the DB killer and bypassing the clutch interlock, this bike is awesome.

So get on down to South Valley this week (weather should be fantastic) and get some seat time on it. Tell 'em Chris Ross sent ya. I get nothing from them, but have been in and out of their store riding anything and everything the last year and a half. And finally pulled the trigger on one of their bikes. Really great guys to work with.

Welcome xnuke1! We're neighbors! Starting to get a decent group of members in the area now.

 

[Nathan Wiley]

I just bought my S10 2 weeks ago at South Valley Motorsports in Sandy. They have 2 or 3 S10's. The Black one is the Demo. I got one of the Blue ones. It may be a bit of a drive for you coming down from Cedar City, but if you are serious about the bike, they will let you test ride.

I had a Victory Kingpin, WR250x, Concours 14, and now have the Tenere and KLR650. The engine isn't as refined as the Concours nor does it have the character of the big V-twin. But I just put an Arrow slip on and clutch bypass mod. And now, Holy Crap! It will pull the bars out of your hands in S-mode if you snap the throttle. At first I was a little concerned I made the wrong choice of bike. But after putting on the can and pulling the DB killer and bypassing the clutch interlock, this bike is awesome.

So get on down to South Valley this week (weather should be fantastic) and get some seat time on it. Tell 'em Chris Ross sent ya. I get nothing from them, but have been in and out of their store riding anything and everything the last year and a half. And finally pulled the trigger on one of their bikes. Really great guys to work with.

Thanks for the info Chris.......I had no idea any Utah dealers were stocking Teneres, let alone had a demo bike.

 

[mingo]

Having come off a bmw 800GS parallel twin, the SuperTen's parallel twin feels nothing like it. It's punchy and sounds like an american muscle car.. A friend has a new Dodge Challenger SRT/8 and it has that sort of sound and feel. I'd say the engine has a lot of "character" and I also find it smoother than my 2 bikes ago 1200GS, and the transmission is night and day smoother, I'd say it's best tranny of any bike I've owned.

Ultimately, the only test ride review that matters is the one you take.. you either like it or you don't.. I waited a year to get a test ride and never did find a dealer that had a demo bike, and ended up taking a leap of faith and I'm thrilled with the bike.

 

[bloodline]

I'm at 5000 miles and I agree with others that the bike gets much smoother with age.

The engine protests under a heavy load in Touring mode. It's much smoother in sport mode.

In the real world, the bike is not slow. It's loaded with torque. Torque is boring until you are loaded down and then it's amazing how hard the bike pulls.

I know for a fact that my S10, 2 up, is a LOT faster than a Tiger 800, 1up. All you ever hear about a Tiger is how awesome the triple is. It sounds cool, but it's got nothing on and S10, even with 1 less passenger.

I suspect that if you rode the two bikes back to back, you would think the Tiger 800 is faster and would say it pulls harder and all of those things. I can assure you, that is not the case.

I too feel like my S10 is boring at times. I miss a sportbike at times. I can assure you that when you are loaded with camping gear and on nice twisty road, you will be amazed at how hard it pulls without constant shifting and 12K rpms. It's all smiles.

I'm not going to get into the offroad engine characteristics too much because I don't think you'll find any complaints in that department.

 

[Cykel]

I'm only just past 600 miles, but I'll share my thoughts so far. For reference, my motorcycle lineage has been Suzuki SV650 -> Ducati ST4s -> Honda VFR800.

Definitely more vibes than the Honda, but overall I find the engine to be fantastic. There do seem to be some resonant points, but they fall well short of bothersome. Based on my readings I expected more initial vibration / clunk / what have you...but perhaps the Ducati skewed my reference on that a bit.

The only time I really felt "slow" was on a ride with my father, in Touring mode, him on his Speed Triple. I switched to Sport mode and all was fixed.

Of the four bikes, the Interceptor and this one are my favorite engines. I picked the S10 over keeping the Interceptor and I don't regret it one bit.

 

[Nathan Wiley]

I talked to someone at South Valley Motorsports up north and they said they did have a demo available. Maybe I can make a weekend trip out of it. Hit some other dealerships, maybe the Rocky Mountain ATV/MC store.

 

[Dingo]

I talked to someone at South Valley Motorsports up north and they said they did have a demo available. Maybe I can make a weekend trip out of it. Hit some other dealerships, maybe the Rocky Mountain ATV/MC store.

Do it!

No replacement for getting an actual feel for the bike, though what many have written here is spot on.

 

[xnuke1]

A little off topic. But I drove down to the Rocky Mtn. ATV store and expected a wonderland of parts goodness. What I found was a very small display floor with a few items. Maybe .32% of their catalog. And probably 200,000 square feet of warehouse behind the counter! They are mail order kings with a fantastic selection of goods at really decent prices. But they are mail order. So don't go in there hoping to see a store like Fry's Electronics. It's just a warehouse with some staff at the front to handle walk ins.

So enjoy your test ride! I think you will dig it.