LJM
Active Member
Sounds like the bike shop re-mapped a 2014 if so can you fill us in on the details.iClint said:
Thanks
ECU reprogram or a AKRO
- Thread starter SingleTrackMind
- Start date
Thanks
This was the write up http://rideapart.com/articles/adding-power-project-tenereLJM said:
Personally for me I don't care about the numbers. The bike feels smooth throughout the rev range in every gear, and makes more power than necessary for my ability off road. For hooning on the streets or track I have a lighter faster more powerful bike fit for purpose.
The arrow system is lighter and sounds better, power gains are a bonus and a power to weight ratio means more than just power at the rear wheel. Also weight saved through mods means that little bit more I can carry away with me without upsetting the suspension as much.
Great write up ::008::iClint said:
Did you run the bike with the Flash for any time :question:
On the 2010 - 2013 bikes with Arrows there is an annoying surge just off idle that the ECU-U Flash could not solve.
Luckily CJS managed to sort this out on the ECU for less than the cost of a power commander, and compared to buying a flash and a power commander in the UK it is well under half the price.
Like you say the bike is a bit down on power over all other bikes, but I doubt the new GS has any more than 110 at the rear wheel, and my mates Triumph Explorer is really not much quicker than my S10.
Anyone considering a new bike for a bit more speed could probably save a lot of money if they put on a full exhaust system and sorted the fuelling, at UK prices this can be done for under £1,000, trading my 3 year old S10 for a BMW / KTM would require something in the region of £8000.
Even buying used a 2 year old S10 is at least £2,000 less than a similar age / mileage GS, by the time you bump the power you have a bike just as fast, more reliable and still have a enough left for a few tyres and the fuel to wear them out.
LJM
Active Member
Wow that's impressive a 20% gain in HP. I'm sure it's happened before but I've never seen that much gain from exhaust mod & ecu tune. And I agree with you that hp numbers aren't everything it's about smooth linear power but 20% is a huge gain. Did the torque curve go up as well it would great to see the dyno graph on that bike. I'm not familiar with ecu unleashed I'm curious of exactly what there doing to the ecu besides air/fuel ratios. It would also be interesting to see what would the bike be like with exhaust mods stock ecu & a power commander. Thanks for the info Im definitely interested in these mods and am going to see if there any local shops that deal with ECU unleashed.iClint said:
fredz43
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I just have one question after reading that article. Did he measure stock HP or just assume it was 85? All I read is that he said:"Your basic Yamaha Ténéré makes about 85hp at the rear wheel". Then we put on a slip on and measure 93, so say that we gained 8HP. It also shows a video of the second dyno run with the Arrow midpipe and tuned. The first run, then was with the slip on? So, perhaps I am misreading, but it sounds like there wasn't a first run completely stock and it was assumed that baseline was 85. Frankly, gaining 8 HP or almost 10% by only adding a slip on is incredible.
Arrow only claim 9BHP for the full system and just 2.5BHP for their end can so this sounds very high for just an end can.fredz43 said:
You also cannot compare from 2 dyno's or from other bikes, so if the first figure was for another bike / or on another dyno (or a guestimate of what it had prior to the end can fitment) then this 8BHP gain could be 5-6BHP out - which would fit in with what Arrow claim.
My bike measured 99BHP on Race Engineering's Dyno (A Dynojet) when I had the ECU-U Flash installed and 95BHP on the CJS Dyno (A Dynapro) in exactly the same spec before their remap, so if I went to CJS with a standard bike, then fitted an end can that made 2BHP more and then tested it on the Race Engineering Dyno I could wrongly conclude the can added 7BHP instead of the 2BHP it really added.
What is obvious is that the bikes (all years) run very rich up top in stock trim and there is probably @ 3-5BHP to be had just from fixing this with a custom setup, and although few shops offer a custom flash most people will have a Dyno Shop that can setup a Power Commander near them. Add an end can and you should have about 5-8 BHP extra which is pretty good for such simple mods.
LJM
Active Member
Rasher said:
These results are more in line with what an exhaust/mapping mod will do. The 20% claim is hard believe. Is your bike a 2014 ? If so did the ecu unleashed flash make a significant difference ? Maybe better throttle response or torque gains ? As I said before on my 2014 the power band is very linear no flat spots so I'm not sure spending 500 + on a reflash is worth it. Although dropping 10lbs-15lbs by changing exhaust would be nice. Did you try out your exhaust mod with stock ECU mapping ? I would not want to change exhaust only to find out a re flash is needed. I checked ecu unleashed web site and not any info there on exactly what they change with there re flash. Does anyone know details of changes.
Thanks
I do not think I claimed 20%, but think I am close to that figure and you can believe it or not, I took my bike to several Dyno's and got before and after graphs which have been posted many times, including in this topic, although perhaps I just photo shopped them myself.LJM said:
Don't forget I have ditched the very restrictive headers, had the fuelling optimised on the dyno with each cylinder being individually mapped and had the ignition mappings modified as well, the bike is about as close to perfect as it could be - and before you ask "How come your man can do better than Yamaha and their billions of R&D" blah, blah, blah...
....do not forget this bike would no longer pass the tests Yamaha have to pass to get a bike approved for road use (Noise / Emissions) and Yamaha do not set each bike up on the dyno at the end of the production line to account for different tolerances, for example most fuel injectors have a tolerance of +/- 5%, and every engine component will also have small variances so the Yamaha maps also have to be safe for the bike requiring the most fuel, which means they tend to be over-fuelled.
No, but assuming they get the top end fuelling as good as they did on my 2011 it should help a 2014 equally well, when the ECU-U map was flashed the dealer tested fuelling on the dyno and told me it was pretty good - but the bike would feel much better with a power commander as well (so admitted good / better than stock, but not perfect)
CJS Who did the custom flash also said the fuelling at full throttle was pretty decent (and far better than the stock map), but it was quite poor at other throttle openings. (and you will see that ECU-U do state that adding a PC or similar is required to optimise the setup.
Throttle response is tricky, ECU-U ramp up the throttle, now when you turn the throttle around 50% the throttle plates open about 50%, with ECU-U they probably have the throttle plates open 50% when you have only turned the throttle grip 30% - so is this more responsive in your book :question:
If you have more power at the same rpm you must have more torque - the laws of physics tells us this ::008:: If unsure google Power Vs Torque.
If your not spending 500+ why keep asking about what spending 500+ will do :question:
Yes, and I have detailed this, with graphs in other topics, a can will not muck up fuelling, on earlier bikes headers cause an off-idle surge and the ECU-U Flash WILL NOT fix this, a power commander can (at great expense) but I was lucky enough to find a local ECU Tuner who could fix this without having to add a Power Commander.
Most flash providers will tell you they change everything and improve everything etc. in reality you cannot be sure exactly what they have done and how well they have done it - if you want to know this then buy a Flash Tune Harness and do your own flash, but to get a significant improvement you would need a dyno (or find a dyno shop happy to tune your bike with the FT Harness)
I think a 2014 is not going to get big benefits from a generic flash, but it will benefit to some degree.
A custom dyno setup would be better than a generic flash, and probably fitting a Power Commander would be the better option as the fuelling could be perfected for your bike and I am sure it will gain a reasonable amount of power (4-6BHP as a guess, maybe a couple more with an end can) and feel more responsive and smoother.
Sorting out the mega weak closed loop area of the bike will give a much nicer feel, on the dyno it probably shows fairly minimal gains, but it will make the bike feel smoother and more responsive in normal use (i.e. when not caning it) to do this you need some extra add-ons for the Power Commander.
I think you need to think about what you actually want and then work out how to achieve it ::008::
I was surprised to see that post too. I don't know where that supposition is coming from. My Akra appears to be a very well constructed, high quality pipe, and after a year and a half it still looks brand new. ::001::fredz43 said:Must be something wrong with my Akra. Almost 4 years and 42,000 miles in use on 2 different S10's and still no rust. I guess it takes titanium a bit longer to do that.
Cheers,
Bruce
Oh come on, we all know our good buddy Ron. He loves his Tenere, just like most if us. An advocate even.BravoBravo said:
But he must weigh 168lbs, 5'8", and have the perfect length arms and legs to match the computer simulation of a test rider at Yamaha. Cuz Ron don't need or want no stinkin farkles! ::013::
I, admittedly, am cut from the exact negative mold that Ron came from. I can't leave anything alone.
I wish I was more like Ron.
I could shave a couple of YEARS off my retirement schedule.
Good point, snake. If I only had back half of what I have spent over the years on motorcycle accessories, I could probably have already retired! ::013::snakebitten said:
Bruce