Will you take the vaccine

will you take the vaccine

  • yes

    Votes: 91 37.0%
  • no

    Votes: 24 9.8%
  • maybe later

    Votes: 21 8.5%
  • heck no

    Votes: 30 12.2%
  • BTDT - Got the shot

    Votes: 80 32.5%

  • Total voters
    246
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Sierra1

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How about the families that are anti-vaccine . . . . until a family member dies. Then they're all about getting the vaccine. I wonder how the surviving members feel, or rationalize, that a loved one is needlessly gone. I just don't understand.

My neighbor flip flops as to whether he's pro/anti vaccine. His most common "anti" vaccine argument is that we don't know the long term side effects . . . . as he puffs on his cigarette. He is correct as far as knowing the 10, and 20 year effects on a person. But, if you die from covid in the mean time . . . . it's a moot point. I also remind him that nobody worried about the long term issues of any of the past vaccines, and we had a lot less science than we do now.
 

Wallkeeper

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I also remind him that nobody worried about the long term issues of any of the past vaccines, and we had a lot less science than we do now.
Good point. I wonder if it is because the pre-Boomer generations had up close and personal experience with multiple scourges like Polio, Tetanus, Rubella, Diptheria et. al.?
 

AVGeek

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I really only have one lingering question: how much protection does recovering from COVID provide?

I also see that the FDA is looking at the mix and match approach, which has the most interest for me.
 

thughes317

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Good point. I wonder if it is because the pre-Boomer generations had up close and personal experience with multiple scourges like Polio, Tetanus, Rubella, Diptheria et. al.?
Or...the fact that previous generations did not have an overwhelming amount of information (both good and bad but that's a subject for another day) available to them 24/7/365 right at their fingertips?
 

WJBertrand

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Good point. I wonder if it is because the pre-Boomer generations had up close and personal experience with multiple scourges like Polio, Tetanus, Rubella, Diptheria et. al.?
Yes, I think diseases like those are “abstract” to younger generations so they cannot fathom the miracle that vaccines are. I have had friends left with permanent disabilities from polio. It’s like a certain younger congress person who thinks we have a whole generation that has not experienced prosperity, when that person was actually born into it and in fact has not experienced poverty. They say one can’t appreciate beauty without ugly.


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Sierra1

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I really only have one lingering question: how much protection does recovering from COVID provide?

I also see that the FDA is looking at the mix and match approach, which has the most interest for me.
I've read that antibodies developed from having the virus, last longer than vaccine antibodies. I've also read that developed antibodies combined with vaccine antibodies, is resulting better, longer lasting antibodies. That might be where the "mix-n-match" is coming from, which I just heard about today. But, since Pfizer, and Moderna vaccines are pretty much the same, with different dose amounts. . . . and the Johnson vaccine is different from them . . . . are we to mix the Johnson with one of the other two?

Because my first two shots were Moderna. Initially Pfizer was claiming a higher efficacy than Moderna; both being higher than Johnson. Later reports were claiming Moderna was proving to be more effective. Moderna doses are 100mcg, whereas Pfizer's is only 30mcg. So, if both vaccines degrade over time, with Moderna lasting longer than Pfizer . . . . doesn't that show that more is better? And, now, Pfizer's third dose is the same 30mcg, but Moderna's third is only going to be 50mcg. Personally, I'd rather have a third 100mcg dose. But, they're still learning, so . . . . guess we'll find out.
 

Don T

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Don T

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Or...the fact that previous generations did not have an overwhelming amount of information (both good and bad but that's a subject for another day) available to them 24/7/365 right at their fingertips?
The problem with "an overwhelming amount of information" is that it requires education, knowledge and not least an understanding of the concept "critical thinking" to sort out the difference between reliable information and BS.
 

Sierra1

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I really only have one lingering question: how much protection does recovering from COVID provide?
Here's an article I just read, addressing your exact question:



A growing body of research suggests infection plus vaccination provides the strongest protection against a wide range of variants, possibly for a long time.

People who were infected and then vaccinated some months later have "what's called 'hybrid immunity,' which is like super-immunity," said Warner Greene, a virologist at the Gladstone Institutes in San Francisco.

This combined protection seems to last a long time, according to a new study in the journal Science. It may last far longer than vaccination alone, he said, though that hasn't been proven yet.


Greene warns against seeking out infection to get such good protection, though. Severe disease is no fun and can strike anyone.

Infectious disease expert Dr. Monica Gandhi said public health officials too often downplay the protection provided by infection.

"To deny natural immunity does not generate trust," said Gandhi, an infectious disease expert at the University of California, San Francisco and San Francisco General Hospital.

Getting vaccinated three months – or even better, six months – after infection provides the best possible protection, she said. But adding a second shot offers almost no additional benefit over the first, nor do people who have been fully vaccinated and infected need a booster at this point.

"If you're naturally immune, get one dose," Gandhi said.

In a new study from the Rockefeller Institute in New York, researchers found that people who get vaccinated after catching COVID-19 may be protected against a wider range of variants than people who get vaccinated alone.

Still, said Theodora Hatziioannou, an author on the study, if you have to pick one, go with vaccination.

Shots, she said, lead to higher levels of neutralizing antibodies, naturally made substances that fight an infection. Neutralizing antibodies wane with time, so the more you start out with, the better.

"At five-six months post-vaccination or infection," she said, "the vaccinated participants had overall higher levels of neutralizing antibodies than the infected, including against variants."

Unanswered questions
There are still open questions when it comes to natural immunity and the protection it affords.

It's not clear, for instance, how soon someone can get infected with COVID-19 a second time.

The CDC "is actively working to learn more about reinfection to inform public health action," according to spokesperson Kristen Nordlund. "This is a priority area of research for CDC."

For young, healthy people, an infection may provide 80% to 90% protection against a reinfection, she said. But in older adults and those who are immunocompromised, an infection may be less protective.

In Denmark, for instance, of nearly 12,000 people who tested positive during the first wave of coronavirus infections last year, more than 80% were protected in the second surge. But among those 65 and older, protection against repeat infection was only 47%. Protection didn't seem to fade over time.

Milder or asymptomatic infections may provide less protection than severe ones.

Unvaccinated people who had COVID-19 are more than twice as likely as fully vaccinated people to get COVID-19 again, Nordlund said.

Studies are still being done, she said, to better understand whether repeat infections are milder than initial ones.

"One would expect so," Hatziioannou said. "The immune responses developed during the first infection should offer some protection against severe symptoms the second time around."

But variants might make a difference. For example, she said, blood from people previously infected with the so-called beta coronavirus variant might not be able to fight the delta variant as well as people infected with the virus in its original form.

Jeffrey Shaman, an infectious disease epidemiologist at Columbia University's Mailman School of Public Health, said it's frustrating to be this far into the pandemic and still have so little understanding of repeat infections.

Though it should be relatively easy to count how many people get infected after vaccination – data the CDC stopped collecting this spring – it's much more challenging to learn how many people are getting repeat COVID-19 infections.

If they're not very sick, he said, they are unlikely to report those infections.

Early studies suggested some people were developing different types of immune responses to infection, he said. Some developed protection against the virus' spike protein, the same target of vaccines. They seemed less likely to develop a repeat infection.

But it's possible that as the virus that causes COVID-19 continues to evolve, another variant will come along and people whose immune systems responded to a different part of the virus will be better protected, he said.

Dr. Robert Glatter, an emergency physician at Lenox Hill Hospital in New York City, said he worries about patients who had a severe reaction to COVID-19 the first time.

He has seen a number of patients whose symptoms are worse with a second infection, perhaps because they have immune cells that are "primed to respond in an exaggerated or more aggressive fashion during a reinfection."

Countries that have tried to rely on natural infections to slow the spread of the virus, such as Brazil and Iran, "have not prevented recurrent waves of infection," Glatter said.

"There is no country in the world where natural infection and natural immunity has slowed the pace of the pandemic or helped to bring it under control."
 

WJBertrand

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Information is worthless until you have verified the source. If that turns out to be impossible you have no other option than to write the information off as BS - or at best a hearsay.
And frequently, even knowing the source, you can still write it off as BS!


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Tenman

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My 67 year old friend got her 2nd moderna shots months ago. Got c19 anyway. She wasn’t extremely sick. FWIW Got an infusion and got over it in a few days
 

Checkswrecks

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My 67 year old friend got her 2nd moderna shots months ago. Got c19 anyway. She wasn’t extremely sick. FWIW Got an infusion and got over it in a few days
I was talking to an infectious disease doc the other day when we were in port and what you describe is what he said was the secondary purpose of the vaccine. The primary purpose is to cut transmission for the majority and secondary is that for those who get it anyway, to keep them out of hospitals and dying.

Data is bearing him out.
 

Cycledude

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Ran into a friend that happens to be a retired nurse yesterday and we got to talking about a local FedEx driver that unfortunately died while making a local delivery, the owners of the home where this happened saw him arrive and go into the back of the truck but never come out with a package, so he goes out to see what was going on, well the driver was laying on the floor vomiting so they called ambulance, they picked him up and wound up flying him to a different hospital where he died, they said he was 41 years old and had recovered from Covid-19’s in September, they said the heart attack was caused by blood clots from having Covid-19’s. Anyway my friend the retired nurse thinks the Covid-19’s shot causes blood clots, he is a pretty smart guy and refused getting the vaccine himself but in this case I think he is way off.
 

Sierra1

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From what I've heard/read, there is an extremely small chance of blood clots. More with the J&J than the other two. But, it was my understanding that it happens soon after the vaccine is administered, not weeks later. But, of course, they're still learning, and everybody is different.
 

pooh and xtine

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“Experts” are the curse of the modern world because their opinions are tainted by vested interest driven by enhancing their own self importance, funding, remuneration, staffing levels, influence and covering their own backs to avoid being sued. There are as many opinions as there are experts so the policy challenge is in applying common sense and cutting through the bias. Experts never get criticised for being over-zealous in their doom mongering, but fail to warn what could / may / might possibly happen and you’ll lose your reputation.
 

WJBertrand

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They’ve just approved the Moderna boosters here in CA. Wifey and I are scheduled for Monday. Got our flu shots a week ago.


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