Why we choose ABS or no ABS when off road

[Nikolajsen]

In reality the brakes do really well for the places this bike would normally go with an average rider off road.

I totally agree on this

 

[ballisticexchris]

It would be nice to have a switch on the bars to toggle the traction control on the fly. When riding down a trail I don’t want to stop and think about what tc mode I’m in. Or stop to switch it for a sand section, and then stop and switch it back. Over and over.

I haven’t found a way to loft the front tire on my S10. It will take the weight off the front somewhat.

I also don’t find that I have to abuse the clutch much on this bike. It has gobs of torque on tap. I also don’t ride slower than 7mph idle speed.

The biggest limiting factor for me is ground clearance. Good line selection is essential.

I always think back to a motocross coach’s words

“Smooth is fast” and “fast is smooth”
And
“Slow and steady is better than fast and crash, work on technique and practice on getting smooth”. Because
“Smooth is fast” and “fast is smooth”

I hear you there!! Ground clearance is a biggie on these bikes. You might want to consider some raising links. I only banged the plate a few times through the rocky sections. These babies make a big difference.
https://www.yamahasupertenere.com/index.php?threads/raised-dog-bones-easy-install-and-way-to-get-ground-clearance.26852/

As I get more saddle time my mind might change. As it is for now, I just grab my Beta for anything more technical than a forestry road. Only reason I pushed forward on Toroweap is I was really convinced the last section was not all that hard. There was no way I could have made it through some of those rocks at idle speed. I almost had to trackstand and crawl over some of that stuff. A lot of foot dabbing and short bursts of throttle.

I'm pretty much "aged out" of trying to get any faster. This is the very biggest bike I have ever owned. I'm taking the off road portion of travel in baby steps. Good news is I do have a decent knowledge of my comfort level.

 

[Cycledude]

I have never monkeyed with the traction control.
did have to ride a couple hundred feet in 6 inches of new wet snow on my gravel driveway , one of the lights on the dash was blinking but with a little help from me pushing I made it through just fine.
another time on my return home from a trip there was about 8 inches of very heavy wet snow on my driveway , made it most of the way to my garage just fine but there was a to deep drift in front of my garage so I had to park the Tenere and Get the tractor out to plow the snow away, most Of the snow melted the next day.

 

[AVGeek]

I like the idea of a rear shut off for the ABS for off road but love ABS for on pavement. Overall I would rather have the option of turning off Traction control then ABS, several thousand miles off road and never really felt the need for it although it would have been my preference to have it off. TCS however, that makes me swear out loud when in the dirt.

Are you talking about turning off TC on the fly? TC can be disabled on these bikes, but it does turn back on when you cycle the key.

 

[Jlq1969]

Chris ... I think this issue of abs on or off .... should be discussed personally

 

[ballisticexchris]

I figured there would be a lot of opinions on this. There is no "one size fits all" when it comes to this subject.

 

[SuckSqueezeBangBlow]

Are you talking about turning off TC on the fly? TC can be disabled on these bikes, but it does turn back on when you cycle the key.

Well now I just learned something new today! The sales guy told me that it could not be turned off and that position 1 was the best because it was the least invasive. I just went back to the manual and read section 4 (page 28 I believe) and it showed me how to turn it off. Not only that but 1 is the most controlling. Wish I had known that before heading out onto the dirt.
Thanks for pointing that out!

 

[ballisticexchris]

Well now I just learned something new today! The sales guy told me that it could not be turned off and that position 1 was the best because it was the least invasive. I just went back to the manual and read section 4 (page 28 I believe) and it showed me how to turn it off. Not only that but 1 is the most controlling. Wish I had known that before heading out onto the dirt.
Thanks for pointing that out!

In reality TC 1 is very handy in slippery tight technical sections. TC 2 is good at keeping you rolling in the loose stuff. TC off is not needed until you get in deep (dune like) sand, or steep loose hill climbs. And when I say steep, I'm talking the kind that if you drop the bike you're screwed. A good set of tires, clutch/throttle control will overcome almost any situation with TC on.

 

[RonH]

My gripe with ABS and traction control comes when operating on bumpy roads. Either system is completely useless in these conditions. This is why most prefer to shut off ABS off road because the system cuts off the brakes over bumps ect, and you may have virtually no brakes. Not a good feeling off road or on.
I never wanted it, but we got it "free". Yay.
Don't trust it much either. All forums say worst case scenerio, something goes wrong, the computer shuts off the ABS, and the system reverts to manual brakes. Not so on my wife's 2014 Jeep wrangler. We get an error code saying "right rear wheel sensor". When this happens ABS is "on" forever, so no matter how gentle you are braking, the stupid thing thinks the wheel is locked and ABS is engaged non-stop, so essentially you have no braking. Then the problem immediately goes away, and brakes work great, and may work great for a month, or may not work 30 seconds later. No telling. Of course replacing the sensor did nothing. I can so easilly live without this.

 

[jeckyll]

In reality TC 1 is very handy in slippery tight technical sections. TC 2 is good at keeping you rolling in the loose stuff. TC off is not needed until you get in deep (dune like) sand, or steep loose hill climbs. And when I say steep, I'm talking the kind that if you drop the bike you're screwed. A good set of tires, clutch/throttle control will overcome almost any situation with TC on.

Tc1 really isn't good off-road. If you get to a sudden climb it may leave you stuck.

On 'easy' off road I would recommend Tc2, once things get more challenging turn it off. And if things get knarly, disable ABS. Having the ability to spin the rear can be a real asset.

YMMV,but that works best for me.

 

[Mak10]

Tc1 really isn't good off-road. If you get to a sudden climb it may leave you stuck.

On 'easy' off road I would recommend Tc2, once things get more challenging turn it off. And if things get knarly, disable ABS. Having the ability to spin the rear can be a real asset.

YMMV,but that works best for me.

This exactly.

 

[ballisticexchris]

So far TC 1 and TC 2 are working great for me. A big part of it is the tires I'm using. The Anakee Wilds just flat out grab!! I'm always looking for traction. I'm not a skid and spin type of guy.

 

[SuckSqueezeBangBlow]

Tc1 really isn't good off-road. If you get to a sudden climb it may leave you stuck.

On 'easy' off road I would recommend Tc2, once things get more challenging turn it off. And if things get knarly, disable ABS. Having the ability to spin the rear can be a real asset.

YMMV,but that works best for me.

Well said. I am going to try #2 and see how much slip it will allow. Coming around a corner and finding a washboard is not fun when it is on full traction control. Maybe 2 will be enough but will likely turn it off and just go lighter on the throttle. The Shinkos hook up really well so I have no concerns for grip from the tires.
Looking forward to the weekend!

 

[bnschroder]

if you only need to turn off the rear abs, do it yourself, you just need a button, a relay, a bit of cable and a few pin-cables and voila .... if you step on the rear pedal only, activate the relay with the stop light , and that relay joins the signals-pulse of the front turn sensor with the rear one (the ecu will believe that the rear wheel turns the same as the front and no need abs, but the rear wheel is blocked). If you press the front lever, you will continue to have the combined brake. With the button, you cut the power to the relay, when you don't want it to be abs turned off

I fear that won't work, because once you turn the ABS off (with the typical aftermarket or self-made handlebar switch), you need to cycle the ignition to get it back on. Otherwise your idea would indeed be brilliant.

 

[Jlq1969]

I fear that won't work, because once you turn the ABS off (with the typical aftermarket or self-made handlebar switch), you need to cycle the ignition to get it back on. Otherwise your idea would indeed be brilliant.

I did not say at any time "turn off the abs with the aftermarket switch" ..... so clarify that 1) the relay only activates with the rear breake, and does not turn off the abs, simply joins the front turn signals and rear, then the rear wheel is locked, but the rear sensor cable receives pulses from the front sensor, so the ecu believes that the rear wheel is spinning and does not operate the abs. 2) If you do not touch the rear brake, and use "only the front", you will continue to have the braking combined with abs included 3) with the switch, just cut the power to the relay that joins the pulses, do not turn off the abs ... "It would be a kind of emulated to the ecu", but only in a matter of pulses ...

 

[HeliMark]

Well said. I am going to try #2 and see how much slip it will allow. Coming around a corner and finding a washboard is not fun when it is on full traction control. Maybe 2 will be enough but will likely turn it off and just go lighter on the throttle. The Shinkos hook up really well so I have no concerns for grip from the tires.
Looking forward to the weekend!

I use #2 all the time, and #1 if crappy weather on road. Off road, #2 works great, but if there is a decent up hill with the washboard, you will wish for it to be off. I was going up a mild hill that was washboard in #2, and the TC started doing its thing about halfway up. Lost a lot of energy, and made it more interesting then it needed to be.

 

[SuckSqueezeBangBlow]

I use #2 all the time, and #1 if crappy weather on road. Off road, #2 works great, but if there is a decent up hill with the washboard, you will wish for it to be off. I was going up a mild hill that was washboard in #2, and the TC started doing its thing about halfway up. Lost a lot of energy, and made it more interesting then it needed to be.

So had a great ride on the weekend, did some nice dirt and gravel as well as a few water crossings. With the TCS switched to #2 it was pretty good like you said and basically that is where I left it. As we got into some water crossings I had it on the Off position and glad I did, the bike behaved very well, not sure I would have made it in position 1.

Plus got to do some nice roosters

 

[~TABASCO~]

Just my opinion, LOL

Ive almost had two very serious accidents on the street. I THANK ABS for saving me both times (on road)... When it comes to off road (for people that don't know me or have not ridden with me) I ride my Tenere like a 450 Moto cross bike. I ride hard, fast, off road, pussy-cat on paved roads. I cant recall turning OFF the ABS one time while owning the Tenere. With all the thousands of total miles I have ridden in the dirt with the Tenere, there have been a few times that I thought to myself "that would have been even more fun with the ABS off",, but I made it and it was all good.

For me, and me alone, my thought is this....... I DO NOT get paid millions of dollars from a factory race team to get everything out of the bike or a track. Im just a guy that likes to ride. ABS has saved my A$$ many times. For me, on the whole, ABS is a great thing and I just leave it on... At my age, if im doing over 100 Mph off road (again) and cant slow down, and the thought ever comes in my mind that I should have had the ABS turned off.............. I NEED TO SLOW THE -F- DOWN and chill out... LOL. I leave it on !!

Don't you just love that feeling when you're doing 100 mph on a gravel road, then hit some sand then gravel, and bike moves all around. I love that feeling ! ! Am I strange or is this normal ?

By the way, I raced Moto X for ten years as a kid, and have been on motorcycles over 35 years. Ive ridden plenty of bikes, on and off road with and with out ABS. I know the pros & cons of both...

 

[2talltoo]

Sooo.. the CTE is from Moto X not football.

 

[SuckSqueezeBangBlow]

Don't you just love that feeling when you're doing 100 mph on a gravel road, then hit some sand then gravel, and bike moves all around. I love that feeling ! ! Am I strange or is this normal ?

No, you are strange! Lol! It does take getting used to though. Being Canadian I refer to it as skating since it feels like you are sliding around. Never been up to 100 but when we were in Colorado I did make a sustained 75 mph (real not on the speedo) run and that was the fastest dirt run I had ever done. This dude on a KTM passed me at 100 mph as per his GPS tracking route software, and that was impressive.