HARD START

Cycledude

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Checkswrecks said:
We've seen over and over that with these big twin 600cc cylinders, that with a slightly weak battery, the current draw through the starter is so big there's not enough voltage for the ECU to run the ignition.
Mine has only had the no start issue twice and luckily both times the bike was at home in my garage when it happened, it’s a totally unacceptable issue but Yamaha really doesn’t seem to care much about it.
 
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I have had a hard start twice on my 2011 S10 under different conditions and did contact Yamaha UK who claimed to have no record of the problem.
I have approacded this problem from a different assumption, that the hard start is caused by EMC, conducted emission noise from the starter and have fitted a capacitor to the starter circuit to minimise any conducted noise.
This mod has been in place for a year with no further hard starts experienced but it will need more time before we can say that it has been successful.
 
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I said years a go , and a say it now it is rider caused . I have had it 3 times in 80k plus miles and it was my fault . You just have to understand the EFI cooled start protocol .
 

Cycledude

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yz454 said:
I said years a go , and a say it now it is rider caused . I have had it 3 times in 80k plus miles and it was my fault . You just have to understand the EFI cooled start protocol .
You could be right, could you please explain the EFI cooled start protocol ?
 

EricV

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Have you talked with Anthony? He likely can sort you out or would have a pretty good idea what to check/start with.
 

Cycledude

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cavenger said:
So i recently got my Ecu flashed by Anthony and ever since I've gotten it back, I have been having a lot more hard starts. This is not only food for thought for others but also to throw it out there to see if you guys have any thoughts on it. Oh and I should add I just replaced the battery. It is not the battery.

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Yikes that would be pretty worrisome !
 
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So before this gets out of hand.. I want to let you guys know that after I posted this, I started my bike several times with no problems. I need to personally do more research before I state that it had anything to with the reflash. Anthony says he has never seen this and I trust him on that. For that reason, I am going to edit my original reply.

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SilverBullet

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cavenger said:
...Anthony says he has never seen this and I trust him on that..
I would believe that statement also. I have over 100k miles after his reflash and not a single hard start.

_

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I too have his reflash no problems.
However last Sunday my bike acted like the battery was dead. Not enough juice to start it. I got in to jump start it and found a loose battery connection. I tightened it and it’s worked fine ever since!


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Getting ready for a long trip. I'm still on my original OEM 2.5 year old battery, and no indications of problems as of now. I'm debating changing it before I go, just to get rid of a possible hard start in the middle of nowhere. Am I worrying too much about a young battery, or has anybody had theirs fail within 3 years? Next one will be a Yuasa YTZ14S unless I get talked out of it. Thx
 
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Arizoner said:
Getting ready for a long trip. I'm still on my original OEM 2.5 year old battery, and no indications of problems as of now. I'm debating changing it before I go, just to get rid of a possible hard start in the middle of nowhere. Am I worrying too much about a young battery, or has anybody had theirs fail within 3 years? Next one will be a Yuasa YTZ14S unless I get talked out of it. Thx
I don't have the brand in front of me but I got a really nice new battery more powerful, blah blah blah. It does it just as bad if not worse. Mine is really doing it now and I don't know why.

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Checkswrecks

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With the AGM installed by Yamaha, you have a mid-life battery unless you live somewhere really hard on batteries, or if you keep letting it fully discharge. Assuming you are in Arizona, it may be worth taking the battery to a store to do a load check, but if it has had no issues, the AGMs are good for a lot longer than 2 years normally.
 
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Checkswrecks said:
With the AGM installed by Yamaha, you have a mid-life battery unless you live somewhere really hard on batteries, or if you keep letting it fully discharge. Assuming you are in Arizona, it may be worth taking the battery to a store to do a load check, but if it has had no issues, the AGMs are good for a lot longer than 2 years normally.
Yes, I'm in Arizona. Bike is ridden regularly, but usually in moderate temps...45-95F temps (95 is a moderate high for Arizona at least).

I think I'm just going to spend the $$ now on a new battery as an insurance policy, instead of trying to milk another number of months out of it.

Thanks for the input.
 

RonH

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Of course buying a new battery is not a bad idea normally, but even new can go bad, and the first few months is the real test. I put a new $200 Ford battery in a 1993 E350 van and it lasted 12 miles, drove it 12 miles on day one, all fine, day 2 battery was at 0.00v, dead short from pos to neg.. I trust a working battery more than a new one for the first few months at least. In other words I wouldn't replace the battery right before leaving on a trip unless necessary.
 
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How widespread is this issue with Gen 1's? I'm thinking of pulling the trigger on a '13, which I've chosen for numerous reasons not least of which is the absence of reliability issues compared with, ahem, some other popular 1200cc adventure bikes.

But just found this thread, and must admit it's made me a little bit lairy. I ride alone often, in (by UK standards) sparsely populated areas. Intermittent show stopping probably electronic issues of no clearly recognised cause are a worry. Am I right to be concerned, or are these classic symptoms of internet-induced anxiety!
 

Checkswrecks

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Brewers Whoop said:
How widespread is this issue with Gen 1's? I'm thinking of pulling the trigger on a '13, which I've chosen for numerous reasons not least of which is the absence of reliability issues compared with, ahem, some other popular 1200cc adventure bikes.

But just found this thread, and must admit it's made me a little bit lairy. I ride alone often, in (by UK standards) sparsely populated areas. Intermittent show stopping probably electronic issues of no clearly recognised cause are a worry. Am I right to be concerned, or are these classic symptoms of internet-induced anxiety!

A few bikes had the issue, but not the majority and most folks never had a hard start. When you see a thread like this here or on a forum for any other machine, they become magnets for the few people who focus on that one topic. I'm not saying it wasn't an issue for some, but of the thousands and thousands of these bikes built, look for how many of these are posts by the same people. FJRs had the grounding spider and key switches, Harleys had a cam issue, BMWs...ummm you get the idea.


That said, if you go back through the thread, there shouldn't be a worry about becoming stranded. Having a healthy battery means a lot and we've learned to replace the OEM 12S model of battery with the bigger capacity in the 14S. When going to start the bike, let the instrument needle do it's full sweep and the fuel pump sound to end before pushing the starter button. When the bike does start, don't shut it off right away, let the idle stabilize or even let it run for a minute. Not doing these is a way to increase the odds of a hard start the next time. Even if you force the bike into a hard start, it'll almost always clear and start on the next attempt by holding the throttle in the full open position while cranking.


For the couple bikes which STILL have an issue, the owners have gotten them to start, as listed in these pages.
 
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SilverBullet said:
I would believe that statement also. I have over 100k miles after his reflash and not a single hard start.

_

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Where can I find info on Anthony's reflash? I just pick up a 15 non-ES bone stock...

Thanks!
 
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