SouthmtJim
New Member
long trips, I carry a spare filter. guess I can stop doing that.
Filter change - every or every other oil change
- Thread starter bnschroder
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RonH
Guest
I never change the crush washer on any motorcycle I've ever owned and never have had a leak. I bought a pack of 10 for the goldwing 11yrs ago because of threads where several guys acted like it was crucial to change them. I still have 10. Maybe some guys over torque and ruin the washer? Don't know, but torque to spec and never a leak.
Strange thing on the GL1800, it seems like most guys that believe in changing the final drive lube 6 times or whatever, before the recommended first change are nearly always the guys that have failure early. Sometimes overdoing things has no real benefit.
Strange thing on the GL1800, it seems like most guys that believe in changing the final drive lube 6 times or whatever, before the recommended first change are nearly always the guys that have failure early. Sometimes overdoing things has no real benefit.
taskmaster86
Active Member
It was about 6,000 miles and two years total that I left the filter on. I change the oil every 3 to 4 thousand miles because that is about what I end up doing for miles in a year. I wish I had more time and opportunity to ride and get the mileage up but it is what it is.
The factory maintenance schedule wants us to change the filter every 12,000 miles so I am still way undercutting Yamaha's service recommendation by changing the filter every 2 years and 6 to 8 thousand miles or so.
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ballisticexchris
Guest
I for one will not buy something just because I "read it on a forum thread". I change my crush washers because it's cheap and simple. My KTM 300, Beta both trans and motor side, and both Toyota Lexus's use the same washer so it's a no brainer. I do agree it's not crucial. BTW, crush washers are ruined as soon as they are used once. Never heard of a driveline failure because it was over lubed?
That is why a lot of guys purchase Japanese bikes. It's proven time and time again you can beat the crap out of these bikes and get super lazy on maintaining them with no ill effects. These threads always have guys like myself that are very picky about keeping our bikes running in top shape. On the other side of the spectrum you have the guys who just ride the crap out of them, skimp on proper service, and wait until something breaks. Sometimes it don't break. It's a roll of the dice for sure.
EricV
Riding, farkling, riding...
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There are two types of washers generally referred to as "crush washers". One is a hollow washer that does indeed crush as it is tightened. These are technically one time use, though the world doesn't end if you re-use them and many people do.
The other type of 'crush washer' is a solid copper or aluminum washer that will deform if you over torque the drain/fill bolt, hopefully saving your threads in the case. These are commonly re-used until they deform so much that they become thin and would not offer any protection from over tightening. Some diligently anneal these prior to re-using them. No harm in that, but it's a little over kill for the application.
In factory fresh form, the Super Ten uses both types. My '12 came with the hollow style crush washer on the oil drain plugs and the solid style on the final drive drain and fill plugs. Only Yamaha's assembly team knows why. I changed to solid copper style at the first oil change and may have replaced them a few times in 109k miles, but certainly not every time.
As far as Japanese Vs other brands. When you get used to a high maintenance bike, it's hard to get your head around low maintenance bikes. It's not poor maintenance or lazy to follow the manufacturer's maintenance schedule. It's just a better made bike. It doesn't need maintenance after every ride. 90% of what a KTM owner thinks is necessary, is necessary on a KTM, and totally superfluous on a Yamaha.
The other type of 'crush washer' is a solid copper or aluminum washer that will deform if you over torque the drain/fill bolt, hopefully saving your threads in the case. These are commonly re-used until they deform so much that they become thin and would not offer any protection from over tightening. Some diligently anneal these prior to re-using them. No harm in that, but it's a little over kill for the application.
In factory fresh form, the Super Ten uses both types. My '12 came with the hollow style crush washer on the oil drain plugs and the solid style on the final drive drain and fill plugs. Only Yamaha's assembly team knows why. I changed to solid copper style at the first oil change and may have replaced them a few times in 109k miles, but certainly not every time.
As far as Japanese Vs other brands. When you get used to a high maintenance bike, it's hard to get your head around low maintenance bikes. It's not poor maintenance or lazy to follow the manufacturer's maintenance schedule. It's just a better made bike. It doesn't need maintenance after every ride. 90% of what a KTM owner thinks is necessary, is necessary on a KTM, and totally superfluous on a Yamaha.
Which is why when somebody asks me what is the best bike to get....I just tell them anything made in Japan, but I prefer Yamaha. Beemer brags about their quality and engineering superiority, but can't back it up; in my opinion.
I don't see any reason not to follow Yamaha's 10,000 km oil change recommendation. Feeding it Yamalube synthetic and the oil level hasn't budged. I do change the filter everytime though just to get as much of the old oil out as possible.
Dirt_Dad
Well-Known Member
Founding Member
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I do wish the Japanese would see fit to build the same type of bikes built in Europe, but they don't. That's how I ended up with a German bike in the garage. Hopefully, some day, the Japanese will figure out that people shorter than 5' 8" are willing to spend good money on full featured, non-top heavy, adventure bike. I see nothing in the pipeline suggesting that idea has dawned on them.
As for oil changes, I run the Yamaha full synthetic. Had some 7K miles trips before doing the oil changes. Always do a new OEM filter at every change.
Im thinking of getting one of these for my bike ,any feedback will help .
Expensive ,but could work out cheaper over a few years .
Very green saving the planet
http://www.pcracingusa.com/Artic-Cat-ATV-PCS1_p_17.html
This one fits Super Tenere
Expensive ,but could work out cheaper over a few years .
Very green saving the planet
http://www.pcracingusa.com/Artic-Cat-ATV-PCS1_p_17.html
This one fits Super Tenere
jrusell
Well-Known Member
Much poorer filtration than a normal paper/synthetic filter. Look up beta ratios for normal filters and compare to a beta ratio for this filter. Guess what you can't find a beta ratio for this filter.....Why? Think about it.
So thousand of miles with a oil pump running at 20-30psi pushing particles into a filter. I am supposed to believe I can back flush a filter with a spray can of brake cleaner when I can't access the inside to flush properly?
No anti drain back valve, so a dry start every time I start the bike.......NICE feature.
I think the last video they tried to say it had 2 times the filter area of a normal filter. Pure bs.
Flows 7 times more than normal filter. Flow is determined by the oil pump not the filter.
Waste of money. Dry starts every time is enough to never see one of these on any bike of mine.
So thousand of miles with a oil pump running at 20-30psi pushing particles into a filter. I am supposed to believe I can back flush a filter with a spray can of brake cleaner when I can't access the inside to flush properly?
No anti drain back valve, so a dry start every time I start the bike.......NICE feature.
I think the last video they tried to say it had 2 times the filter area of a normal filter. Pure bs.
Flows 7 times more than normal filter. Flow is determined by the oil pump not the filter.
Waste of money. Dry starts every time is enough to never see one of these on any bike of mine.
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oil and filter every 12 months wether bikes done 3000 miles or 7000 miles
rob
rob
VRODE
Easy Does It
I’m not obsessive by any means, I just try to think practically. Every 4K I do an oil change. I figure it can’t hurt and it’s not expensive. As far as filter changes, I can’t fathom running clean, fresh oil thru a dirty filter, so new filters always.
I did f/d oil changes at the same time for the first 15k, now every other oil change.
I did f/d oil changes at the same time for the first 15k, now every other oil change.
My opinion: There are bikes out there, and on here, with hundreds of thousands of miles. Whether they use OE, or after market, they have not failed due to poor oil circulation. I can buy a whole lot of filters for what that company wants for their filter. And, I turn in my old oil for recycling, so the only thing that I'm "wasting" is the filter itself. By the way, I'm an OE filter & oil guy.
WJBertrand
Ventura Highway
With those stainless ones, you may not be tossing oil filters but what about all the additional HC emissions from whatever solvent you are using to clean them and what a mess to deal with? All that an inferior filtration performance too? No brainer for me to skip that idea.
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ballisticexchris
Guest
LOL, I remember years ago heated internet arguments on the pros and cons of those stainless filters. Scotts is still making them for a bunch of models. I think they are a good choice if you are in a remote part of the world where standard filters are unavailable. Also no denying the convenience of a quick spray clean, and reinstall.
Here is one that's available for our Super Tenere:
https://www.scottsonline.com/Product_Purchase2.php?Bike_ID=7104&BI_ID=588543
Tenman
Well-Known Member
Good oil filters are cheap and proven in all kinds of motorsport. Sticking with them.
blitz11
Well-Known Member
Here's a story.
my brother is an engineer with Caterpillar. Caterpillar once made most of the HD on-road truck diesel engines on the planet. (They left the market when emissions regulations became too stringent - a decision my brother still sees as a huge mistake.)
Anyway, Caterpillar did a big study with oil and oil changes, and found that in most cases, changing the oil filter with every change introduced MORE dirt into the engine than changing every other time. The source of most of the additional dirt was due to a lazy mechanic/technician who failed to clean around the filter mount. When they went to slap the filter on, they'd knock dirt into the filter cavity, which found its way into the oil. To reduce wear/increase oil life, they recommended filters every other oil change.
He is a materials engineer, and did some of the analysis.
Personally, I swap them every time, but clean around the filter before removing it to minimize dirt finding its way to new oil.
my brother is an engineer with Caterpillar. Caterpillar once made most of the HD on-road truck diesel engines on the planet. (They left the market when emissions regulations became too stringent - a decision my brother still sees as a huge mistake.)
Anyway, Caterpillar did a big study with oil and oil changes, and found that in most cases, changing the oil filter with every change introduced MORE dirt into the engine than changing every other time. The source of most of the additional dirt was due to a lazy mechanic/technician who failed to clean around the filter mount. When they went to slap the filter on, they'd knock dirt into the filter cavity, which found its way into the oil. To reduce wear/increase oil life, they recommended filters every other oil change.
He is a materials engineer, and did some of the analysis.
Personally, I swap them every time, but clean around the filter before removing it to minimize dirt finding its way to new oil.
Thanks Jrussel .
And of course your correct .
Just the back up info I neaded .
blitze11 .
In my experience with a Case dozer, I was a bit careful to steam clean engine and filter areas before any servicing.
Sometimes finding the grease nipple to adjust the Tracks was a bigger problem ,what with caked in clay and dirt around Rams .
And of course your correct .
Just the back up info I neaded .
blitze11 .
In my experience with a Case dozer, I was a bit careful to steam clean engine and filter areas before any servicing.
Sometimes finding the grease nipple to adjust the Tracks was a bigger problem ,what with caked in clay and dirt around Rams .
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Stantdm
Active Member
Fresh filter every change. Just no reason not to for me.