"Factory Fixes" on brand new ST ES

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#61
Hey, let us spew BS to you first! ;)

Define low rpm shifting response. At what rpms are you shifting and describe what bothers you.
I guess I’ll put it this way; 1st 2nd and 3rd are the worst with roll on roll off throttle to shift. Snatchy jerky whatever you want to call it Maybe it’s me but the transition between up shift and applying throttle is not smooth. 2nd gear is the worst. I would call a momentary lapse in throttle sensitivity. I’ve improved it slightly by barely pulling in on the clutch lever at shift and not rolling off the throttle completely.
 

Don T

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#62
There is nothing "wrong" with the throttle response on the S10.
Coming from another bike with a different throttle response it can take a bit of getting use to, but with practice the S10 can be ridden perfectly smooth even in S mode.

As already mentioned checking the spokes by sound doesn't work on the S10 (and other bikes with similar wheels) - a torque wrench is needed.
 
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#63
I guess I’ll put it this way; 1st 2nd and 3rd are the worst with roll on roll off throttle to shift. Snatchy jerky whatever you want to call it Maybe it’s me but the transition between up shift and applying throttle is not smooth. 2nd gear is the worst. I would call a momentary lapse in throttle sensitivity. I’ve improved it slightly by barely pulling in on the clutch lever at shift and not rolling off the throttle completely.
As I understand it, there is not a direct 1:1 correlation between hand throttle rotation and throttle plate actuation in the first 3 gears hence the sensation you describe (exacerbated by heavy engine breaking). Unlike some here, I was just not able to retrain my right hand so I went the route of a flash......absolute best improvement I have made to this bike! Just my .02.
 

EricV

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#64
I guess I’ll put it this way; 1st 2nd and 3rd are the worst with roll on roll off throttle to shift. Snatchy jerky whatever you want to call it Maybe it’s me but the transition between up shift and applying throttle is not smooth. 2nd gear is the worst. I would call a momentary lapse in throttle sensitivity. I’ve improved it slightly by barely pulling in on the clutch lever at shift and not rolling off the throttle completely.
Admittedly its hard for me to fully understand this since I have ~150k miles of riding Super Tens at this point. I'm just very used to the bike as it is. And like it the way it is. The engine braking, for me, is just another part of the bike's effective package of handling characteristics. I say that coming from a bike that had very little engine braking, (the FJR's inline four).

It sounds like you are shifting slowly and the rpms are falling off more during your shift. This can be worse when you short shift.

When you feel you notice this the most, what rpm are you shifting at when you transition from 1st to second? 2nd to 3rd?
 
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#65
As I understand it, there is not a direct 1:1 correlation between hand throttle rotation and throttle plate actuation in the first 3 gears hence the sensation you describe (exacerbated by heavy engine breaking). Unlike some here, I was just not able to retrain my right hand so I went the route of a flash......absolute best improvement I have made to this bike! Just my .02.
Must be my problem; I’m not a 1:1 ratio kind of rider.
 
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#66
As I understand it, there is not a direct 1:1 correlation between hand throttle rotation and throttle plate actuation in the first 3 gears hence the sensation you describe (exacerbated by heavy engine breaking). Unlike some here, I was just not able to retrain my right hand so I went the route of a flash......absolute best improvement I have made to this bike! Just my .02.
I may have to bite the bullitt and flash.
 
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#67
As I understand it, there is not a direct 1:1 correlation between hand throttle rotation and throttle plate actuation in the first 3 gears hence the sensation you describe (exacerbated by heavy engine breaking). Unlike some here, I was just not able to retrain my right hand so I went the route of a flash......absolute best improvement I have made to this bike! Just my .02.
Yeah the engine breaking is hefty in the lower gears hence me trying not to let off too much at shifts. Just seems like that requires a bit more concentration than I would like to put in to it. Trying to concentrate on traffic and road conditions and whatever else. I don’t need any operational distractions. KISS riding.
 
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#68
Admittedly its hard for me to fully understand this since I have ~150k miles of riding Super Tens at this point. I'm just very used to the bike as it is. And like it the way it is. The engine braking, for me, is just another part of the bike's effective package of handling characteristics. I say that coming from a bike that had very little engine braking, (the FJR's inline four).

It sounds like you are shifting slowly and the rpms are falling off more during your shift. This can be worse when you short shift.

When you feel you notice this the most, what rpm are you shifting at when you transition from 1st to second? 2nd to 3rd?
Not sure. Not looking at the tach unless I’m getting on it hard or cruising down the freeway.
 

EricV

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#70
Not sure. Not looking at the tach unless I’m getting on it hard or cruising down the freeway.
You may simply be shifting at too low an rpm for this engine.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but perhaps you need to start paying attention.
 

Sierra1

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#71
....I'm just very used to the bike as it is. And like it the way it is. The engine braking, for me, is just another part of the bike's effective package of handling characteristics. I say that coming from a bike that had very little engine braking, (the FJR's inline four).

It sounds like you are shifting slowly and the rpms are falling off more during your shift. This can be worse when you short shift.

When you feel you notice this the most, what rpm are you shifting at when you transition from 1st to second? 2nd to 3rd?
Uh....what he said....exactly....and remember, you can adjust your clutch lever too.
 
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#72
Yeah the engine breaking is hefty in the lower gears hence me trying not to let off too much at shifts. Just seems like that requires a bit more concentration than I would like to put in to it. Trying to concentrate on traffic and road conditions and whatever else. I don’t need any operational distractions. KISS riding.
I came from the world of in-line 4 UJM's which are not known for strong engine breaking. While I can appreciate the advantages of the robust engine braking on the S10, I could never get used to it from the perspective of smooth , low speed control (roll off the throttle and get my head snapped forward instead of just coasting like I'm used to on the in-lines). Yes, I could pull in the clutch every single time I reduced throttle input to avoid the excessive breaking but that got old rather quickly. I had the flash pull a good % of the braking out in S mode but left it pretty much stock in T mode. Now I can smoothly tool along in 1st gear without doing the bucking bronco rider imitation. Again....to each his/her own.
 

RonH

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#74
I've owned a multitude of motorcycles over the last 50yrs and find little to gripe about on this motorcycle. Engine braking is a zero concern. If it brakes too much pull in the clutch or simply don't turn the throttle fully closed at 7,000rpm. Not sure what the big issue is, but no big deal. I've owned so many pieces of crap over the years. Honda V45 Interceptor? There have been some real "gems" over the years. Maybe younger riders expect perfection? I guess perfection is pretty hard to get in anything. Back when I started riding it was rare to see any motorcycle last more than 10,000 miles before being totally junk. So we need to check the spokes every 4,000 miles? Not difficult. The motorcycle is a real technical marvel in my opinion. I was sold the first picture I saw in 2010 and ordered that day.
 
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