Another CCT failure

DG K3 1000

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Half way through day 5 of a 7 day loop through British Columbia bike decided to not start. Spent half a day at small shop in Creston where owner decided he could not ID the problem (only charged me for an hour of time) had it towed to a Yamaha dealer in Cranbrook a 110 km away and spent another 6-7 hours in shop while they tried everything but to no avail. I said it may be the CCT - I have 65000 km on bike and was going to have it replaced this winter- and they agreed that may be the problem but parts were at least 10 days out. Rented a UHaul to move bike to Vancouver area and now bike has been in the largest Yamaha dealer in the area (Holeshot) for over 3 weeks. Still waiting for parts with an estimated cost of $2500!
In last 12 years I have gone through a Vstrom and a Varadero and thought this bike would be the best of the 3 but very disappointed. I purchased it this year with 50K on it and hoped that would match the mileage on previous 2 bikes. Got 150K on Vstrom and 115K on Varadero with very little problem. Oh well season is quickly coming to an end and once I get bike back will be putting away for the winter.
MORAL - watch out for the CCT, at least on the 2012. Very expensive problem is not replaced.
 

Dogdaze

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Sorry for you bad luck. But this is well known fault of the Gen 1 models and although only a few casualties, most have either upgraded to the 2014+ CCT or a Graves manual version that have higher mileages.
 

RCinNC

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Coincidentally, there's another discussion that touches on this subject over on a thread I started yesterday. Did you have any sign that the CCT might be failing, like the characteristic clattering noise from the engine when it was started cold?
 

EricV

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Sorry you had a failure. Most of the failures have been at mileages over 80k kms. Mine was at 83k MILES and one of the first back in 2014. I had plenty of advance notice that the CCT was getting sloppy, but like you, I was on a long trip and hoped to deal with it upon my return. I made it home, but made the fatal error of changing the oil before taking it to the dealer. That brief moment of low oil pressure when I went to start it after the oil change allowed the cam chain to slip and perhaps because I kept cranking, resulted in engine damage. two valves, a piston and some minor other parts damaged. More parts replaced and a valve job while doing the repairs. That bike is still running strong with an updated CCT.

Not to poke a sore spot, but if you had done some quick research here on this forum when you bought the bike, you would have been more aware of the known issue and may have been able to avoid the failure.
 

SilverBullet

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God I hate to read these accounts, so avoidable. I place the blame on Yamaha, this should be a recall. Number# 1 bad rap and bad PR for the Tenere. Otherwise an outstanding reliability record.
 

BWC

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God I hate to read these accounts, so avoidable. I place the blame on Yamaha, this should be a recall. Number# 1 bad rap and bad PR for the Tenere. Otherwise an outstanding reliability record.
Agreed. I’ve spoken to a few new owners of first Gen bikes and encourage them to have it done, if not done already. And if they haven’t had a first valve clearance check that’s a very good time to replace the CCT as the bike will be mostly down to what is required for a replacement.
Hoping DG K3 1000 is back on the road soon.
 
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ballisticexchris

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God I hate to read these accounts, so avoidable. I place the blame on Yamaha, this should be a recall. Number# 1 bad rap and bad PR for the Tenere. Otherwise an outstanding reliability record.
I don't blame Yamaha at all. It looks like owners are running these bikes without doing proper maintenance. Of course if you plan to just run the bike until it drops this is the sad outcome. I'm old school when it comes to valve adjustments. I replace CCT, timing chain, and dampers when removing cams and shimming for clearance. The chain and dampers are normally under 100 bucks total. CCT's are bit pricey at around 200 bucks but well worth it for piece of mind. It's also a great time to check clutch plates and basket for wear at the same time.

I can never understand why some guys spend a huge wad of money on the bike and cheap out on basic service.
 

WJBertrand

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I plan to change the tensioner when I do my upcoming 52K service even though I have a 2nd gen model. The new ones come pre-loaded so I can avoid the hassle of resetting the current one. It also appears that Yamaha has changed it again since 2015. I got it for about $165 at Partzilla and doing the work myself I'm still way ahead compared to what the dealer would charge. I'm not concerned about the chain so will leave that be. My Honda ST1300 went over 150K miles and I never messed with the cam chains.
 
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ballisticexchris

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I plan to change the tensioner when I do my upcoming 52K service even though I have a 2nd gen model. The new ones come pre-loaded so I can avoid the hassle of resetting the current one. It also appears that Yamaha has changed it again since 2015. I got it for about $165 at Partzilla and doing the work myself I'm still way ahead compared to what the dealer would charge. I'm not concerned about the chain so will leave that be. My Honda ST1300 went over 150K miles and I never messed with the cam chains.
That's good info Jeff. I always changed the chains and dampers on my dirt bikes. This is a whole new animal for me. More than likely I'll have the shop do my valve adjustment when the time comes.
 

HeliMark

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Half way through day 5 of a 7 day loop through British Columbia bike decided to not start. Spent half a day at small shop in Creston where owner decided he could not ID the problem (only charged me for an hour of time) had it towed to a Yamaha dealer in Cranbrook a 110 km away and spent another 6-7 hours in shop while they tried everything but to no avail. I said it may be the CCT - I have 65000 km on bike and was going to have it replaced this winter- and they agreed that may be the problem but parts were at least 10 days out. Rented a UHaul to move bike to Vancouver area and now bike has been in the largest Yamaha dealer in the area (Holeshot) for over 3 weeks. Still waiting for parts with an estimated cost of $2500!
In last 12 years I have gone through a Vstrom and a Varadero and thought this bike would be the best of the 3 but very disappointed. I purchased it this year with 50K on it and hoped that would match the mileage on previous 2 bikes. Got 150K on Vstrom and 115K on Varadero with very little problem. Oh well season is quickly coming to an end and once I get bike back will be putting away for the winter.
MORAL - watch out for the CCT, at least on the 2012. Very expensive problem is not replaced.
I know it is a long shot, and not being the original owner, but has the shop tried to see if Yamaha will give some "love"? It is a known issue for the Gen 1 bikes, and with the shop manager and you, you may get a little help. Worth a try.
 

EricV

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While Yamaha is aware of this issue on Gen I bikes, a lot of getting love from Yamaha is about the dealer and how they represent you and your bike to the Mothership. And let's not forget that Yamaha Canada is a far different beast than Yamaha USA. Canada doesn't get the long extended YES warranty possibilities that the US riders get.

Being one of the first to suffer a failed CCT, I had a 4 month battle with Yamaha to get my bike covered. Regional reps looking at the bike, a YES manager in MI that demanded parts to be shipped to him for examination, then left them on his office floor for weeks at a time and delays, delays, delays by that same YES Manager.

If the OP goes down that road, the biggest argument in favor of some assistance from Yamaha would be the low miles at which the failure occurred. That's the lowest mileage I can recall hearing about for a CCT failure. The age of the bike and unknown service history will be tough to overcome, as will the two prior shops messing with the bike before it got to the current Yamaha dealer. If the current Yamaha dealer doesn't want to go to bat for the owner with Yamaha, there is no point in trying. And never, EVER use the word "worn" with a YES Warranty claim! Wear is specifically not covered.

Side note; there are no specs in the FSM or with Yamaha for checking the timing chain itself. Not length, stretch indications or even new specs. Yamaha only says to replace it if it's "obviously damaged" and otherwise will not authorize warranty coverage in most cases. After some back and forth during my claim, I simply agreed to pay for a new chain myself, as it did not make sense for me to be doing all the other work and putting an 83k mile timing chain back in the engine.
 
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ballisticexchris

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Side note; there are no specs in the FSM or with Yamaha for checking the timing chain itself. Not length, stretch indications or even new specs. /QUOTE]
Very interesting info Eric!! I stand corrected on changing timing chain when doing valve adjustment. I'm so thankful for this service manual. The way Yamaha does it is by the wear of the cam sprocket. More than 1/4 tooth wear and you change sprocket, chain, and crankshaft as a set. The way you measure the wear is by using the chain roller as the reference (section 5-18). Pretty damn clever as the roller is hardened and will not lose much of it's it's diameter over the life of the sprocket. Boy that would be a pricy repair bill!! Good news is the chain and sprocket look very stout.

The factory service manual is a pretty damn good read. I dare say this manual is every bit as good as the Honda and Kawasaki manuals I've used in the past. Very detailed and well thought out. Way better than the piece of crap KTM manuals on CD. And very comparable to my Beta manual on PDF.
 

EricV

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That's a great catch Chris! When my CCT failed, I did a lot of reading of the FSM, (I always buy the paper genuine copy when I get a bike), and could not find that tid bit. And neither the dealer techs or regional rep would or could tell me any way to determine if the chain should be replaced or not. It was very frustrating at the time. Makes me wonder if that is in the '12 FSM and I missed it, or if it was added to later copies. My '14-15 FSM has it on 5-18 as you mention.
 

SilverBullet

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...And neither the dealer techs or regional rep would or could tell me any way to determine if the chain should be replaced or not....
Another way if using a manual CCT is lack of any additional adjustment. IIRC that was part of eemsreno's reasoning when he replaced his cam chain at around 120K miles. His Graves CCT only had a thread or two of adjustment left. After he installed a new cam chain the Graves tension bolt went to minimum adjustment. Too bad the OEM CCT's don't have any way to determine at what adjustment point they are at (or do they?). I've already bought a cam chain to have on hand for the next time I have to lift cams to swap shims.
 

EricV

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Which makes me wonder what eemsreno's cam sprockets looked like when he replaced the chain? If Yamaha's threshold for chain replacement is cam sprocket wear, you would think it would be time for both items if either was being replaced.
 
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RonH

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Unless the Yamaha is entirely different than other motorcycles, you'll never see the sprockets wear at all even if the chain is really worn. They don't wear together like wheel sprockets/chains. I have an old 1978 Kawasaki KZ650 that I rode 150,000 miles on the original cam chain and it was pretty well shot, but the sprockets were still not worn even a tiny bit.
 

RCinNC

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Normally you'd replace a sprocket and a chain at the same time, but I think the cam chains are different. They're moving at a pretty high speed, but they don't have the kind of load on them that a drive chain on a motorcycle (or even a bicycle) does, where the chain had to move the weight of the vehicle and the rider. I don't know how much force it takes to turn a camshaft against a valve spring, but based on the fact that neither my Super Ten or my Camry have a recommended inspection or replacement interval leads me to think that the engineers had the assumption that the chain would last as long as the projected life of the engine. I find that kind of odd, but then again, I'm not an engineer, and my only real experience with chains was on a V-Strom drive chain and on my bicycles.
 
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